Spirituality
23 Sep 18
- Joined
- 03 Jan 13
- Moves
- 13080
Looks like you beat my edit:
Probably did.
<< The concept of the "trinity" was necessitated by the insistence of some people's belief that Jesus is literally God even though Jesus did not claim to be literally God during His ministry.>>
He claimed to be God come as a man.
But i know you have presuppositions about what are words Jesus.
What you are not telling us (yet) is that only SOME words of Jesus are for you maybe words of Jesus.
What Jesus said about receiving what those whom He sent as APOSTLES to teach the world about him, cannot be trusted.
Your concise reply carries with it some of these kinds of "behind the scenes" assumptions. I simply know this by previous experience of talking to you.
You must have started formulating your response right after I initially posted it.
Techincally perhaps, that 's true. But I still think my initial answer will do.
Me:
You still have the words of Jesus.
You:
Actually you don't. During His ministry, Jesus did not claim to be literally God.
As there are with you unspoken presuppositions about what words in the New Testament are from the lips of Jesus, so are there also some incorrect caveats with you about what constitutes "His ministry".
Many readers here know full well that ThinkofOne means -
1.) SOME red letters are words of Jesus.
2.) SOME of what the Gospels record are the ministry of Jesus.
3.) NO words or deeds of Jesus after His crucifixion constitute "His ministry".
4.) There is NO ministry of Jesus after He died.
5.) There is NO resurrection and ascension of Jesus as the Gospels record.
6.) How one decides what is authentically of Jesus and what is not will be judged by you on a case by case basis according to whether or not you like it. No rule exists to hamper this purely arbitrary selection process based on your personal preference.
7.) What other parts of the Bible say about Jesus are not important ... UNLESS they agree with your kind of modernist anti-Christian teaching.
Some of us know already by experience how you work
Me:
But most of all you still have people who claim -
"Before I met Jesus I didn't know God ... AT ALL" .
You:
C'mon jaywill. People make claims that aren't true all the time. Just because people claim something doesn't make it true.
I didn't say whatever people claim is true.
But history is filled with 2,000 years of people testifying that the way to know God came to them in receiving Jesus.
YOUR arrogance assumes only YOU know best and they were all wrong.
Ezekiel 18
24“But when a righteous man turns away from his righteousness, commits iniquity and does according to all the abominations that a wicked man does, will he live?
Nothing said here about eternal destinies. It is just speaking of physically living or dying.
Trying to hammer the New Testament into an expansion of Ezekiel 18:24 doesn't work.
If God meant Ezekiel 18:24 to be the total word of the Gospel there would have been no need for another whole testament to be written, let alone for many chapters and other books following Ezekiel to be added.
How come the Bible didn't STOP .... with Ezekiel 18?
All his righteous deeds which he has done will not be remembered for his treachery which he has committed and his sin which he has committed; for them he will die.
Let's just leave it here for now. The Bible did not close with Ezekiel 18. Sorry.
Got something in the NT ?
Matthew 7
23Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’
It says He never knew them. It doesn't say there is NO Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.
Try again.
You are reading the words "Depart from me, I never knew you."
But you are thinking in your mind from the words "There is no Redeemer Jesus Who died and rose for our eternal justification."
The words you recall accurately. The concept you insert into the teaching is your own unbelief in too much else of the Bible.
People claim to "know God" and "know Jesus" even though they have not ceased to sin - have not ceased to do evil.
Hmmm. Maybe that is why the NT exhorts us to GROW ... in the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.
Ya think ?
"But GROW in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.
To Him be the glory both now and unto the day of eternity. Amen." (2 Pet. 3:18)
I did say that receiving Jesus will result in great peace in one's heart. I did not say that there would be no further need to "grow in the grace and the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ."
25 Sep 18
Originally posted by @sonshipEvidently you haven't gotten any better about understanding the posts of others.Looks like you beat my edit:
Probably did.
<< The concept of the "trinity" was necessitated by the insistence of some people's belief that Jesus is literally God even though Jesus did not claim to be literally God during His ministry.>>
He claimed to be God come as a man.
But i know you have presuppositions about ...[text shortened]... rther need to [b]"grow in the grace and the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ." [/b]
As I've so often pointed out, when you take sentences out of context and consider them as if they were said in a vacuum, it makes it impossible for you to understand the meaning.
- Joined
- 03 Jan 13
- Moves
- 13080
Failing as a reliable teacher of Christian theology you are quick to put on your English teacher hat instead.
The necessity for coining an expression of "Trinity" was largly occasioned because -
Jesus did proclaim Himself to be God incarnated.
As I wrote above -
He claimed to be God come as a man.
Originally posted by @sonshipYou fail as a "reliable teacher of Christian theology" precisely because you are unable to understand what others are saying - including the words spoken by Jesus during His ministry.
Failing as a reliable teacher of Christian theology you are quick to put on your English teacher hat instead.
The necessity for coining an expression of "Trinity" was largly occasioned because -
Jesus did proclaim Himself to be God incarnated.
As I wrote above -
He claimed to be God come as a man.
Jesus did proclaim Himself to be God incarnated.
Actually Jesus did not proclaim that during His ministry. Claims to the contrary are nonsensical just like the trinity.
25 Sep 18
Originally posted by @handyandyYo!!! excuse me!!
Note to OP: Obviously, this isn't the place to get a simple, straightforward answer.
25 Sep 18
Originally posted by @karoly-aczelWhat was your simple, straightforward answer?
Yo!!! excuse me!!
26 Sep 18
Originally posted by @handyandyWe create the world with our thoughts. Those who live righteously shall know the will of the Lord
What was your simple, straightforward answer?
26 Sep 18
Originally posted by @karoly-aczelYour first sentence could cause confusion in the minds of those who believe God created the world and its inhabitants.
We create the world with our thoughts. Those who live righteously shall know the will of the Lord
In the Lord's Prayer we defer to God's will -- "thy will be done" -- and pledge obedience to God's laws and ordinances.
26 Sep 18
Originally posted by @wittywonkaIt's saying that the praying person wants the Father's will be done.
In the Christian tradition, the Lord's Prayer is:
"Our Father in Heaven,
hallowed be your name.
Your kingdom come,
[b]your will be done,
on earth as it is in heaven."
Matthew 6:9-10, English Standard Version
Could someone with more knowledge/experience explain: who is the "by whom" implied in the line "Your will be done"? In other words, ...[text shortened]... ying, "Your will be done by us"--as in, "May we do to/in the world whatever you see fit"?[/b]
Originally posted by @handyandyWell how about- "We conjure our realities from our relative sense of righteousness' " ?? . look I'm not into magic or whatever but in essence that is what we do . We only see more than one because thats how we are conditioned. There is only one reality and you supposed to fuse onto that in your own way.
Your first sentence could cause confusion in the minds of those who believe God created the world and its inhabitants.
In the Lord's Prayer we defer to God's will -- "thy will be done" -- and pledge obedience to God's laws and ordinances.
26 Sep 18
Originally posted by @handyandyThe Lord created all... God is the Lords will perfected in the individual. right thinking. . ... .. I know, but hey, after all it has been a long time. cheers
Your first sentence could cause confusion in the minds of those who believe God created the world and its inhabitants.
In the Lord's Prayer we defer to God's will -- "thy will be done" -- and pledge obedience to God's laws and ordinances.
26 Sep 18
Originally posted by @karoly-aczelCheers!
The Lord created all... God is the Lords will perfected in the individual. right thinking. . ... .. I know, but hey, after all it has been a long time. cheers
- Joined
- 03 Jan 13
- Moves
- 13080
Originally posted by @thinkofone
Actually Jesus did not proclaim that during His ministry. Claims to the contrary are nonsensical just like the trinity.
"His ministry" to you is entirely arbitrary. It means some of the red letters which you approve of up until His death.
All your code phrases I understand pretty well by now.
I take "His ministry" to mean what the New Testament says is His ministry in its full scope.
Originally posted by @sonshipIt's not as "arbitrary" as you try to make out:Actually Jesus did not proclaim that during His ministry. Claims to the contrary are nonsensical just like the trinity.
"His ministry" to you is [b] entirely arbitrary. It means some of the red letters which you approve of up until His death.
All your code phrases I understand pretty well by now.
I take "His ministry" to mean what the New Testament says is His ministry in its full scope.[/b]
What was the length of Jesus' public ministry?
The Bible does not tell us the exact number of days Jesus Christ served in public ministry. However, a close look at the chronological data revealed in the Gospels allows us to carefully reconstruct a timeline with a good degree of accuracy.
To begin, Luke noted that the ministry of John the Baptist began in the 15th year of Tiberius Caesar's reign, which was the year AD 26. Jesus began to minister shortly after this time at approximately the age of 30 (or perhaps "early 30s"; Luke 3:23). His crucifixion took place in either AD 30 or 33, indicating that His public ministry took place within the AD 26—33 timeframe.
https://www.compellingtruth.org/length-Jesus-ministry.html
Instead of focusing on semantics, what about the fact that Jesus did NOT proclaim Himself to be God incarnated during His ministry?
26 Sep 18
Originally posted by @thinkofoneYou should study scripture and not just the parts you like.
It's not as "arbitrary" as you try to make out:
[quote]What was the length of Jesus' public ministry?
The Bible does not tell us the exact number of days Jesus Christ served in public ministry. However, a close look at the chronological data revealed in the Gospels allows us to carefully reconstruct a timeline with a good degree of accuracy.
To be ...[text shortened]... hat about the fact that Jesus did NOT proclaim Himself to be God incarnated during His ministry?