‘Eternal suffering’ is nonsensical

Originally posted by @secondson
"I strongly believe that you can make yourself unsaved".

What did you [b]do to make yourself saved? How then can you do something to make yourself unsaved?

Just asking.[/b]

Please do not misunderstand what I'm trying to say.
Say you're saved, but keep on doing wicked things, living a sinful way on purpose. Would you say you're still saved or have you become unsaved again?

Originally posted by @divegeester
Which part of of the sound of my posting gives you this impression?

wow - how two people see the same thing YET you still deny it - going around and around in circles.

Originally posted by @secondson
"I strongly believe that you can make yourself unsaved".

What did you [b]do to make yourself saved? How then can you do something to make yourself unsaved?

Just asking.[/b]

Look if I'm wrong to believe in the statement "once saved always saved" then I'm wrong, but I do believe saved means saved from eternal suffering and save in Gods hands. But I do think that God is sovereign and true and just, if you take God for granted or mock God, and continue living a sinful life on purpose, He will let you go.

Or not?

Originally posted by @nicksten
wow - how two people see the same thing YET you still deny it - going around and around in circles.

Don't worry about my little exchange with returning user @SecondSon; focus instead on my question to you above which you have side-stepped with this post.

Originally posted by @nicksten
I get what you're saying, and maybe its difficult for me to grasp it that quickly and easily.
Look, I believe that once you're saved you're saved BUT that doesn't mean you can now live in sinful/wicked ways "cause you're save". I strongly believe that you can make yourself unsaved.

In my previous post I said the statement is false yet here I'm saying ...[text shortened]... ter how an evil of a person you become, you're always saved and that is foolish to believe that.

Sometimes people adopt a doctrine as part of their beliefs which superficially makes sense. However if they put it under the light of truth, they begin to see the flaws.

"Once Saved Always Saved" is one such doctrine.

From what you've written here, it seems like you are now on the fence on this one. Perhaps you need to spend more time deciding whether or not you should have adopted this doctrine in the first place.

Of course, what you quoted from Ezekiel 18 combined with what I quoted from John 8, Matthew 16 and John 5 show that the requirement for eternal life entails that one no longer commits sin. I imagine that this probably also runs contrary to doctrine you have adopted. Perhaps you should put this under the light of truth as well.

Originally posted by @thinkofone
Sometimes people adopt a doctrine as part of their beliefs which superficially makes sense. However if they put it under the light of truth, they begin to see the flaws.

"Once Saved Always Saved" is one such doctrine.

From what you've written here, it seems like you are now on the fence on this one. Perhaps you need to spend more time deciding wh ...[text shortened]... rary to doctrine you have adopted. Perhaps you should put this under the light of truth as well.

<<Of course, what you quoted from Ezekiel 18 combined with what I quoted from John 8, Matthew 16 and John 5 show that the requirement for eternal life entails that one no longer commits sin.>>

So you maintain that after one accepts Christ, he or she cannot commit a single sin and maintain his or her salvation?

And I assume you’re aware that sins include coveting, bearing false witness (lying,) being angry with someone and looking on a woman with lust in one’s heart.

Originally posted by @thinkofone
Sometimes people adopt a doctrine as part of their beliefs which superficially makes sense. However if they put it under the light of truth, they begin to see the flaws.

"Once Saved Always Saved" is one such doctrine.

From what you've written here, it seems like you are now on the fence on this one. Perhaps you need to spend more time deciding wh ...[text shortened]... rary to doctrine you have adopted. Perhaps you should put this under the light of truth as well.

Agreed - I still have much to learn and what was taught to me as a young child has obviously sticked. Finding the truth is hard as people have personal views which contradicts with what is given in the Bible - but that is another argument for me - maybe even a doctrine I am battling to fight. I don't know.

Thanks for your post.

Originally posted by @nicksten
Agreed - I still have much to learn and what was taught to me as a young child has obviously sticked. Finding the truth is hard as people have personal views which contradicts with what is given in the Bible - but that is another argument for me - maybe even a doctrine I am battling to fight. I don't know.

Thanks for your post.

Finding the truth is easy pal.
Jesus said so.
If you believe Jesus Christ then do as he commanded.
If you are allowing people to confuse you then you are not listening to Jesus.

Originally posted by @nicksten
Please do not misunderstand what I'm trying to say.
Say you're saved, but keep on doing wicked things, living a sinful way on purpose. Would you say you're still saved or have you become unsaved again?

No worry nicksten, I understand what you're saying. I believe that if a person claims to be a believer, but continues to live an habitually sinful life style, like in adultery, that person may not be saved in the first place.

On the other hand, once one has been born again and sealed by the Spirit of God they will never be unsealed or unborn again.

But they stand to lose any reward. Concider 1 Corinthians 3. Verse 15 in particular.

Originally posted by @secondson
No worry nicksten, I understand what you're saying. I believe that if a person claims to be a believer, but continues to live an habitually sinful life style, like in adultery, that person may not be saved in the first place.

On the other hand, once one has been born again and sealed by the Spirit of God they will never be unsealed or unborn again.

But they stand to lose any reward. Concider 1 Corinthians 3. Verse 15 in particular.

Another one .. 😀

You have a reference for this ..once one has been born again and sealed by the Spirit of God they will never be unsealed or unborn again.?

Originally posted by @rajk999
Another one .. 😀

You have a reference for this ..once one has been born again and sealed by the Spirit of God they will never be unsealed or unborn again.?

Do you have a reference to the contrary?

Unfortunately for you, you don't fully understand the gospel of the grace of God. The law, which you apparently live under says that if you fail to keep the law you're dead, but grace is much more demanding. Grace says if you fall, then get back up and get going again.

Jesus died for all our sins. Past, present and future. Once one is born again and sealed with the Holy Spirit they have a complete salvation, and will never lose it.

When God saves He saves completely. It's a finished product.

Philippians 1:6
Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:

Originally posted by @rajk999
Finding the truth is easy pal.
Jesus said so.
If you believe Jesus Christ then do as he commanded.
If you are allowing people to confuse you then you are not listening to Jesus.

so true

Originally posted by @secondson
On the other hand, once one has been born again and sealed by the Spirit of God they will never be unsealed or unborn again.

But they stand to lose any reward. Concider 1 Corinthians 3. Verse 15 in particular.

I could not have said that better - I'm beginning to understand the saying when God said "They will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand".

The verse you've given makes so much sense - thanks. Opening up things I never even thought of. Its awesome.

Originally posted by @divegeester
You believe that once you are saved you are always saved, and you also “strongly” believe that you can make yourself unsaved?

So you don’t know what you believe do you?

Bump for Nicksten.

Originally posted by @nicksten
I could not have said that better - I'm beginning to understand the saying when God said "They will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand".

The verse you've given makes so much sense - thanks. Opening up things I never even thought of. Its awesome.

Glad to be of service.

You can read the various posters here and make an informed decision about the truth of the gospel even though some of us vehemently disagree on essential points of doctrine.

Remember what Jesus said. "My sheep hear my voice". Let The Word speak for itself.