Originally posted by Phlabibitlook, I come from a family of five who lives on just over 60.000 USD a year...
Why would you post on a subject you obviously know zero about? Just wondering.
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and seeing this guy turn his nose up at $3 million is somewhat offensive to me.
And why would you critique my post, of which you obviously know zero about?
Originally posted by whodeyAnd Pinella did get the Mariners going when their management got him a payroll worth a damn. So Pinella can manage. The Devil Rays are born to lose because their owner wont spend more than 30 million on his payroll
Lou Pinella could not get the Devil Rays management moving. All he asked for was the players and when he did not get them he left. At least give him credit for making the playoffs with the Cubs. Considering they are cursed this is the best he could have done for them.
As for Torre, it seems that Mickey Mouse could manage the Yankees and make the play of ...[text shortened]... inziation that spends more on the pitching staff than the Devil Rays spend on their entire team?
http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/7349692
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"It is difficult, near impossible, to accept a salary cut," Boras said. "Successful people can afford their principles. They understand if they accept the position, there is a great risk the message to all under him is dissatisfaction."
Torre called Cashman on Tuesday and asked to meet with the 77-year-old Steinbrenner and the owners' sons, Hal and Hank, who have taken an increased role in recent month. They spent an hour together, and then Torre was gone.
Steinbrenner let his sons do the talking.
"The objective of the Yankees since the '20s has been to win the championship every year, just as the objective of (Vince) Lombardi with the Packers was or (Bill) Belichick and the Patriots," Hank said. "None of us think we can win the championship every year, but that's the goal. Period."
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"Joe Torre is a great man, he is a legendary Yankee and a legendary Yankee manager," Levine said, adding: "The goal of this franchise is to win the World Series. All of us get up every day knowing that is the goal and all us take that responsibility on. Unfortunately we have not met that goal for seven years."
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It may sound "snobbish" for Joe to turn down the offer, despite the fact that he would still be the most well paid manager or any team, but I think the Steinbrenners topped him.
Originally posted by rubberjaw30First off, the new contract was 5 million, with 3 extra million if the Yanks went to the world series. It was also a pay cut. Joe takes a pay cut for getting to the playoffs 12 seasons in a row? You can't compare him to your family and expect him to be happy when he's insulted.
look, I come from a family of five who lives on just over 60.000 USD a year...
and seeing this guy turn his nose up at $3 million is somewhat offensive to me.
And why would you critique my post, of which you obviously know zero about?
This would be like your job. You are at managing a team at McDonalds, and your crew seldom shows up, and does a poor job if and when they do. This is not your fault, and you run around crazy trying to get things done. The place would fall apart if you decided to give up like everyone else on your team.
Your boss doesn't realize the hard work you do, and he's the one who hired all the idiots you work with. He decides he's going to cut your pay by 1/3. Are you going to take the job, or tell him to cram it?
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Originally posted by PhlabibitHow come Joe's defenders say "it's not his fault" when the team collapses in the playoffs 4 years in a row but always say "Joe won 4 World Championships"?????
First off, the new contract was 5 million, with 3 extra million if the Yanks went to the world series. It was also a pay cut. Joe takes a pay cut for getting to the playoffs 12 seasons in a row? You can't compare him to your family and expect him to be happy when he's insulted.
This would be like your job. You are at managing a team at McDonalds, an ...[text shortened]... going to cut your pay by 1/3. Are you going to take the job, or tell him to cram it?
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Torre was given a huge contract 3 years ago, far in excess of what any manager has ever made. What Yankee management wanted was not the mere making the playoffs (which with the Yankee payroll and talent is expected) but another World Series. The team hasn't been able to get out of the first round since. Why should Torre think he's entitled to a 2 year contract or anything but a base pay cut (which still leaves him the highest paid manager by $1.5 million a year)? And if he had acheived the goal Yankee management has set, he would have made $8 million and been rehired for the 2009 season at another $8 million.
The offer was beyond generous. Personally as someone who watches or listens to about 90% of Yankee games (and has done so through Torre's entire tenure), I think he's an average field manager at best as his pre-Yankee record shows. He might be good in the clubhouse and he certainly is well-liked by the media, but the post-season results for the last 4 years have been dismal. I wouldn't have offered him a contract at all; it's time to see what someone else (preferably Mattingly) can do.
In a sport where the second longest playoff streak is one year and when they are in the same divsion as the team that is consistently the next best team in baseball, making the playoffs 12 years in a row is a huge accomplishment. Money doesn't guarntee anything. The Mets had the highest payroll this year and they ended up with an epoic callpse. Torre;s biggest strength is not tradional x's and o's but decreasing/ diffusing distraction and the Yankees will severly miss that. Torre always gave 100% effort so I am not sure why all of a sudden he needs an incetive based contract.
I think Joe Torre should tell everyone to shove it and take a well deserved retirement from baseball. I remember seeing him play for the the Braves when I was a kid growing up in Georgia in the mid 60's and he has always been a class act as far as I'm concerned. He doesn't neeed to be ashamed of anything with his record. Even when he signed to manage the (hated) Yankees I always respected him.
Originally posted by slimjimJoe Torre is great, you are right. But big deal, why would anyone want the ticket prices and merchandise to go up. How about letting some of the new guys have a chance and let them make a fortune too. Spread it around a little. So what New York doesn't win or maybe they do. Maybe some other sports franchise wins for a while. That might be good for baseball too. Does it really matter that much who wins as long as the sport is enjoyable to watch? To be honest I wouldn't care if everyones salaries in baseball was cut in half including the owners as long as the tickets were cut in half too. I might actually go to a few more games and be able to buy a hot dog too. That would make me a happier fan.
I think Joe Torre should tell everyone to shove it and take a well deserved retirement from baseball. I remember seeing him play for the the Braves when I was a kid growing up in Georgia in the mid 60's and he has always been a class act as far as I'm concerned. He doesn't neeed to be ashamed of anything with his record. Even when he signed to manage the (hated) Yankees I always respected him.
Originally posted by no1marauderI just think it was low class for Stainbrainer to make an ultimatum as he did with the ALDS on the line. If he hadn't said that, he probably could have just said, "Ok, time for us to move on." I believe many of the Yankee players were upset about that being said.
How come Joe's defenders say "it's not his fault" when the team collapses in the playoffs 4 years in a row but always say "Joe won 4 World Championships"?????
Torre was given a huge contract 3 years ago, far in excess of what any manager has ever made. What Yankee management wanted was not the mere making the playoffs (which with the Yankee p ...[text shortened]... a contract at all; it's time to see what someone else (preferably Mattingly) can do.
Once George realized how insulting that was and the feel it gave in the club house he had to make an offer that Torre COULD refuse. Don't fire him, make him quit. I've never had any problem with the job Torre does, when the Sox fired Grady I had hopes we might actually land him. Too bad Tito is doing such a great job, Sox probably are not hiring any time soon.
So, you may call me a Torre defender, but I feel you are playing the Yankee management defender seeing nothing wrong with how this went down. That really is my only problem with the whole thing. Plus, what has Torre had to work with? Old meat and broken eggs that someone else shopped for and Joe was the one who had to prepare it and make it worth ingesting. I think they fired the wrong guy, I'm not impressed with how Cashman brings in all these huge names and all but ignores his farm system.
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Originally posted by PhlabibitI liked your last avatar better
I just think it was low class for Stainbrainer to make an ultimatum as he did with the ALDS on the line. If he hadn't said that, he probably could have just said, "Ok, time for us to move on." I believe many of the Yankee players were upset about that being said.
Once George realized how insulting that was and the feel it gave in the club house he had ...[text shortened]... th how Cashman brings in all these huge names and all but ignores his farm system.
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Originally posted by LeaadasExactly!! It makes me wonder how good the manager is for the Red Sox. I think Mickey Mouse could manage that club as well. Speaking of which, I say that they are as good as in the World Series and will win game 7. Then it will be a walk in the park in the World Series. Its all about the $$$$$$$$$ and less about stradegy!!!!!!
And Pinella did get the Mariners going when their management got him a payroll worth a damn. So Pinella can manage. The Devil Rays are born to lose because their owner wont spend more than 30 million on his payroll
Originally posted by whodeyI'd love to see a list of WS winners, and their payroll. Talent means a lot often enough I feel.
Exactly!! It makes me wonder how good the manager is for the Red Sox. I think Mickey Mouse could manage that club as well. Speaking of which, I say that they are as good as in the World Series and will win game 7. Then it will be a walk in the park in the World Series. Its all about the $$$$$$$$$ and less about stradegy!!!!!!
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Without taking the time to read this entire thread, let me just add this from a Sox fan. Joe Torre is a class act, and I'm glad that he walked away from the table with his dignity intact. It wasn't about the money, he was being insulted...and frankly I'd be surprised if he took any offer from the Steinbrenner's after the way George disrespected him during the ALDS (which is nothing unusual for Mr. Steinbrenner). Best of luck to Joe Torre.