No human has the right to take the life of another. I don't care what the circumstances... You kill them, you're no better. You've ended a life--damned a soul to hell. The arguement is: "They're going to go there anyway, right?" The problem I have with this is, you just destroyed any chances they might have had.
Originally posted by ArchAngelGabriel
No human has the right to take the life of another. I don't care what the circumstances... You kill them, you're no better. You've ended a life--damned a soul to hell. The arguement is: "They're going to go there anyway, right?" The problem I have with this is, you just destroyed any chances they might have had.
Not quite. The currently system in the US gives any murderer a substantial amount of time to repent. Did the murderer give his victim the same time to repent ?
Originally posted by ArchAngelGabrielIf you make a point, you need to substantiate it.
[b]That's my point.[/b]
As I refuted your 'point', you cannot simply restate your premise and expect that to hold.
Again, a murdered that will receive the death penalty, has plenty of time to repent and find God. Should they do so, death is a gift, life behind bars is not.
pc
Originally posted by ArchAngelGabriel
No human has the right to take the life of another. I don't care what the circumstances... You kill them, you're no better..
This is clearly false. If someone tries to kill me, I have the right to kill them in self-defense. You probably want a more restricted claim.
I agree, humans may kill in extraneous circumstances...but we don't have the right in any sense. I just can't believe we were created with that idea in mind. There's a lot of things that every person does that they don't nescessarily have the "right" to do, but they do them anyway... People don't have the "right" to do anything illegal, but they do it nonetheless, correct?
Originally posted by KellyJayMurder is not strictly a legal term, no? According to the
Murder is a legal term, and if this person is to die because they
were convicted of a capital crime it is not murder to have the
sentence carried out.
Kelly
NIV translation, Exodus 20:13 reads, 'You shall not murder,'
along with the concordant passage in Deuteronomy 5:17.
Capital punishment has the ring of 'an eye for an eye,' which
the Matthian Jesus seems to oppose (cf St Matthew 5:38-42).
I don't see how capital punishment is concordant with a
Christian viewpoint, given this explicit admonishment for
equal retaliation.
Nemesio
Originally posted by ArchAngelGabrielSo you think that it is permissible for humans to kill in self-defense, but that they don't have the right to kill in self-defense. You must be using some non-standard notion of 'right'.
I agree, humans may kill in extraneous circumstances...but we don't have the right in any sense. I just can't believe we were created with that idea in mind. There's a lot of things that every person does that they don't nescessarily have the "right" to do, but they do them anyway... People don't have the "right" to do anything illegal, but they do it nonetheless, correct?
Originally posted by bbarrIt would seem to me that being a good Christian forbids
This is clearly false. If someone tries to kill me, I have the right to kill them in self-defense. You probably want a more restricted claim.
even this: '...When someone strikes you on [your] right
cheek, turn the other one to him as well.' (St Matthew 5:39b,
cf St Luke 6:29a).
I've often wondered why self-defense appears to be forbidden.
My conclusion, although I am not confident about it, is that
self-defense is defending the flesh, the corporeal, which is not
worth saving. It is the soul that is worth saving. As such, one
should not commit the evil act of taking another's life, even in
self-defense, because it jeapordizes the status of one's salvation.
Nemesio
Originally posted by nemesioWhy is this relevant to my claim? I don't take the Bible to be authoritative on moral matters.
It would seem to me that being a good Christian forbids
even this: '...When someone strikes you on [your] right
cheek, turn the other one to him as well.' (St Matthew 5:39b,
cf St Luke 6:29a).
I've often wondered why self-defense appears to be forbidden.
My conclusion, although I am not confident about it, is that
self-defense is defending the fl ...[text shortened]... s life, even in
self-defense, because it jeapordizes the status of one's salvation.
Nemesio
Originally posted by nemesioExodus 20:13
Murder is not strictly a legal term, no? According to the
NIV translation, Exodus 20:13 reads, 'You shall not murder,'
along with the concordant passage in Deuteronomy 5:17.
Capital punishment has the ring of 'an eye for an eye,' which
the Matthian Jesus seems to oppose (cf St Matthew 5:38-42).
I don't see how capital punishment is concordant ...[text shortened]... ith a
Christian viewpoint, given this explicit admonishment for
equal retaliation.
Nemesio
You shall not murder.
Deuteromonomy 5:17
You shall not murder.
You will find if you continue to read the OT that there were crimes
that were punishable by death. Do a word search on the words,
"put him to death." You will see punishment for some crimes was
death.
If you are going to talk about murder and St Matthew 5th chapter
may I suggest you stick to the parts of that chapter that talk about
murder directly. You will see that there are warnings of punishment
that go even beyond being put to death, coming out of Jesus' mouth.
Matt 5:22
"...But anyone who says, ‘You fool!’ will be in danger of the fire of hell."
Kelly
Originally posted by bbarrBecause the Bible, like it or not my friend, began the whole idea of morals in the first place. Why do you think God flooded the entire world? Because the humans that lived here were without morals...among other things...
Why is this relevant to my claim? I don't take the Bible to be authoritative on moral matters.