Minimum Wage primer

@averagejoe1 said
I never have known how y'all define greedy. If I can sell my old bike for $100 when it is only worth $75, am I greedy? If a corporate board raises prices on their widgets so that their stokckholders will make more money, is that greed? Average Joe says it is good management, good business. However, if they price themselves out of the market, they will lose customers, ...[text shortened]... logic if you believe the govt should fix the problems in Texas.

I pride my logic on this post.

@joe-shmo
Most of the skilled working class earns above $15 per hr., but not much above. Their wages are not going to change with the law. However, the cost of nearly everything they consume to live is going to rise, because nearly 48% of the US workforce makes below $15 per hr. Do you believe their employers, corporations etc... are going to give them all raises under rising cost of doing business from the minimum wage increase? The net effect is relatively large diminishing returns for the working and lesser extent the entire middle class. If you can tell me how what I said doesn't happen, please do. I'm all ears.

Yes. Historically, all workers get a raise in short order. We've done this before, Joe. Many times before. And now, Big Union has it written into their collective bargaining agreements to get a raise if/when there is a raise in the minimum wage

People on social security get screwed because their boss is the US Government. They will NOT get a raise and Big Gov will continue to pay them with inflated $$Dollars.

@no1marauder -IF businesses could get higher prices for their goods, they'd already charge them.

Sure, if they colluded. (which is why collusion is illegal)
But with the wages going for *everyone*, it allows them all to raise prices.

It isn't like we have never done tis before. The minimum wage has changed 22 times, we know what to expect.

Here's what EoT expects: When the smoke clears, we'll all be in a higher tax bracket.

"And for those of you in Rio Linda" - Limbaugh :-)

Megaditto's y'all

@joe-shmo said
Listen Joe, I'm no lib...but I also have no illusions about corporate greed that you seem to have. I worked in industry...I watched bumbling fools that came from money given VP positions, then they present my work ( as an engineer) as an example of "their" success and earn themselves 50K year end bonuses ( low end ) while simultaneously refusing meager cost of living raises ...[text shortened]... ts faux solution that won't accomplish jack at best. At worst, it takes more money out of my pocket.

@earl-of-trumps said
@joe-shmo
[i]Most of the skilled working class earns above $15 per hr., but not much above. Their wages are not going to change with the law. However, the cost of nearly everything they consume to live is going to rise, because nearly 48% of the US workforce makes below $15 per hr. [b]Do you believe their employers, corporations etc... are going to give them all raise ...[text shortened]... Government. They will NOT get a raise and Big Gov will continue to pay them with inflated $$Dollars.

@AverageJoe1

I didn't read this whole thread so maybe this was discussed already. But there is a conservative case for raising the minimum wage. A minimum wage increase would shrink the size of government.

Low wages have a cost on our society. Low wage earners don't make enough money to feed their families. They are impoverished. They receive benefits from the government in the form of food assistance and tax credits. They receive benefits from other taxpayers because their employers do not pay them enough. My tax bill is supplementing the salary of low wage earners, and the only beneficiary of this is the employer.

I don't know the exact numbers but annual government expenditures were forecast to decrease by ~$30 billion with a $15 minimum wage by raising the earnings of tens of millions of low wage earners.

Raising the minimum wage shrinks the size of government by shifting the burden of responsibility for food/shelter from the government to the employer.

@averagejoe1 said
"It would be highly beneficial to low wage workers." I think, yes, but only for a short period until the real effect of raising the wage is felt. Up go the prices of goods, so their take-home pay does not increase their buying power anymore. Surely we do are not so naive as to think that 'nothing different' will arise when the wages are raised.

@wildgrass said
@AverageJoe1

I didn't read this whole thread so maybe this was discussed already. But there is a conservative case for raising the minimum wage. A minimum wage increase would shrink the size of government.

Low wages have a cost on our society. Low wage earners don't make enough money to feed their families. They are impoverished. They receive benefits from the governm ...[text shortened]... nment by shifting the burden of responsibility for food/shelter from the government to the employer.

@joe-shmo said
The government doesn't shrink...it always grows until it collapses under its own weight. That's pretty much immutable physical law. They, ( like the corporations) will not except a loss in profits ( tax revenue )...they'll just change the game behind the smoke from the blast...

@wildgrass said
With minimum wage increase, this specific part of it will though. Corporations should be paying their full time employees enough to keep them off of government assistance programs.

@joe-shmo said
I don't believe this is the kind of physical system you think it is. The minimum wage is completely arbitrary...the bottom of the heap, it will always be the bottom of the heap regardless of how much it is. We didn't inject any value in the system, we just changed the arbitrary datum from which we measure said value.

@wildgrass said
Obviously the minimum wage number is arbitrary. I wasn't arguing that it's not.

The decrease in our welfare state resulting from increasing the minimum wage is not my analysis. You can find it here: https://www.marketwatch.com/story/a-15-minimum-wage-could-cut-government-spending-on-welfare-programs-by-up-to-30-billion-study-finds-11612290567

There are better ways to ...[text shortened]... rden of food/shelter responsibility from the government to the corporation. Government gets smaller.

Every time I edit the post its get another alert! Try editing yours to see if it automatically gets another "alert"? This is fun!

@joe-shmo said
For pete sake who alerted your post!?! What did you say that was so inflammatory, that min wage is arbitrary?

@wildgrass said
Obviously the minimum wage number is arbitrary. I wasn't arguing that it's not.

The decrease in our welfare state resulting from increasing the minimum wage is not my analysis. You can find it here: https://www.marketwatch.com/story/a-15-minimum-wage-could-cut-government-spending-on-welfare-programs-by-up-to-30-billion-study-finds-11612290567

There are better ways to ...[text shortened]... rden of food/shelter responsibility from the government to the corporation. Government gets smaller.