The burkini

The post that was quoted here has been removed

If you are expecting me to answer your absurd non sequiturs and I don't, then what does that make you?

Originally posted by sh76
What possible business is it of yours or anyone else's how other people want to dress?

If I want to wear my parka in July in Phoenix, then I can. Not because it makes sense, but because it's my right to dress however I like whether you think it's a good idea or not.

Yeah, but said parker is not a religious symbol.

Not that I care, mind, I'm sure plenty of those women look better in burkinis.

However, it, like speedos and strings (in public) are retarded items of clothing.

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Because men could not rape their wives (as the law was for centuries), does it mean that women who agreed to marriage did so on the grounds that they didn't see rape within marriage as the oppression of women?

I.e. Just because Muslim women don't see said clothing as oppressive, doesn't mean it isn't.

That being said, I hardly imagine women emancipation is going to happen by men dictating what they can and cannot wear.

Originally posted by lemon lime
Oh good grief, common sense would be the ability to discern the difference between reasonable caution and unwarranted concern.

From who's point-of-view? A white Christian's point-of-view? How does that point-of-view have any more validity than any other?

Originally posted by phil3000
I think that people walk around " nearly naked " on the beach is because people like to swim and sunbathe .
Can't go swimming in the city ( climate change hasn't kicked in yet ) centre .

What a dodge.
What if people don't want to swim and sunbathe at the beach?
What if people want to sunbathe in the city?
My point is that dress codes for the beach are very cultural and in many ways force people to stick to the norms. People don't generally take off their clothes because it is summer as you previously stated.

Originally posted by lemon lime
How can nuns be oppressed when becoming a nun is a voluntary choice? Last time I checked a woman also has the choice to not be a nun. And if a nun feels oppressed by the rules she's agreed to abide by she can simply walk away from it. Do Muslim women have (without consequences) those same choices?

Nuns face very significant social consequences for walking away. Muslim women, in most cases, do to. Nevertheless, wearing a burka or otherwise following Muslim religious practices is a voluntary choice as is being a nun.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
Interesting I was doing only last week some work for two nuns who manage a rather extensive property, they did not seem the least bit oppressed to me but were rather cheery. Perhaps your experience has been different.

Yes, my experience has been very different. All the Muslim women I know seem very unopressed. The nuns on the other hand seemed very restricted in what they were able to do.

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gee i didn't know you could play the trumpet, what is that? some avant-garde style of jazz?

Originally posted by no1marauder
The idea that the State can enforce its idea of "values" on individuals doing no harm to anyone else is deeply offensive to the idea of freedom.

France routinely violates the rights of religious expression and should be condemned.

No its not, thats why you cannot stroll around a shopping mall in the scud, you might want to, but you cannot because other people don't want to see your nether regions and ask the state to pass legislation preventing you from doing so. Certain clubs also require a dress code as does the world chess federation. Its not an usual phenomena and the French government, being secular in nature does not want to have religious garb on display on the beach. Its not an unreasonable request.

When I was living in Pakistan a man inadvertently raised the issue with me while I was waiting to get my motorcycle repaired. He stated that Muslim women should be fully covered. (they are not really because they reflect Indian fashion and wear whats called a debuta, basically a long headscarf) although Afghanis and those in NWFP do insist on a burka, one of the most offensive and oppressive pieces of garb imaginable. Anyway I digress. I was living with a retired Major from the Pakistani army and I asked him what Islamic teaching was and he stated that there was nothing in the Hadith or the Koran which stated that a women should be fully covered, all that was required was that she should be modest.

Originally posted by no1marauder
The idea that the State can enforce its idea of "values" on individuals doing no harm to anyone else is deeply offensive to the idea of freedom.

France routinely violates the rights of religious expression and should be condemned.

This.

Originally posted by lemon lime
Try evaluating this against the backdrop of reality:

If no one had ever robbed a jewelry store wearing a ski mask, then no one would be alarmed seeing a man entering a jewelry store wearing a ski mask.

And if no terrorist Muslim had ever detonated a suicide bomb in a public place, then no one would be alarmed to see a woman covered head to toe in Mu ...[text shortened]... wear a ski mask when entering a jewelry store, but would you ever seriously consider doing this?

Limiting the amount of clothing people are allowed to wear to prevent people from wearing bombs is downright insane. If someone wanted to wear a bomb and avoid detection, they'd go to a crowded mall in February with a heavy winter coat on, not to a beach in August. On the contrary, terrorists would presumably like to blend in to avoid detection. Wearing a burkini on a beach is hardly the way to blend in and avoid suspicion.

Obviously, fighting terrorism is important. But being sane about it and not becoming a police state while you do is also a good idea.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
Its not an usual phenomena and the French government, being secular in nature does not want to have religious garb on display on the beach. Its not an unreasonable request.

So you are agueing that religious garb may be offensive to some people? If priests were banned from wearing dog collars in shopping malls, would you get behind such legislation?

Originally posted by shavixmir
Yeah, but said parker is not a religious symbol.

So, are you saying you're okay with it being banned because it's a religious symbol?

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
No its not, thats why you cannot stroll around a shopping mall in the scud, you might want to, but you cannot because other people don't want to see your nether regions and ask the state to pass legislation preventing you from doing so. Certain clubs also require a dress code as does the world chess federation. Its not an usual phenomena and the Fre ...[text shortened]... tated that a women should be fully covered, all that was required was that she should be modest.

Apparently the State can also decide that you are wearing too many clothes and that people should be able to peruse certain of your "regions".

🙄

Why you think an entire country can impose a "dress code" on everyone in it without this being an affront to freedom is beyond me esp. when it is quite obvious that the State is targeting a particular minority for no good reason.