12 Jul 06
Originally posted by Dragon FireI suggest that articles 7.4 and 6 .14 of the FIDE Laws are the one's which would apply during a normally timed game; but a lightning event
I have seen some lightning tournaments where a player has made an error and moved the black B onto a white square and it has only been noticed many moves later. Can someone enlighten me on what the rule is in those circumstances (especially if the next round starts 10 minutes later).
may well have it's own rules.
7.4 If during a game it is found that an illegal move, including failing to meet the requirements of the promotion of a pawn or capturing the opponent`s king, has been completed, the position immediately before the irregularity shall be reinstated. If the position immediately before the irregularity cannot be determined, the game shall continue from the last identifiable position prior to the the irregularity. The clocks shall be adjusted according to Article 6.14. Article 4.3 applies to the move replacing the illegal move. The game shall then continue from this reinstated position.
6.14 If an irregularity occurs and/or the pieces have to be restored to a previous position, the arbiter shall use his best judgement to determine the times to be shown on the clocks. He shall also, if necessary, adjust the clock`s move counter.
but in a lightning tournament other ideas may prevail.irregularity. The clocks shall be adjusted according to Article 6.14.
12 Jul 06
Originally posted by aging blitzerHe was pressing the clock with the same hand that moved the piece, but was moving terribly fast. But, as I was moving slow, and pressing the clock deliberately and carefully, he had an opportunity to get there before my hand had left. I had more than half an hour and needed to slow the tempo and frustrate his efforts. My position was lost, but the clock gave me good drawing chances if I could run out his time. I consulted with the TD, who then watched the game and warned him that I must be allowed to finish depressing the button on my end before he could move. That was all I needed. After a few more moves his clock expired, and I claimed the draw.
I thought your move was finished when you let go of the piece (if it has been moved to another square [legally] )
but you are supposed to press the clock with the same hand that moved the piece though, I thought.
Here's the game along with the annotations I wrote for our local newsletter:
[Event "River City Memorial"]
[Site "River City"]
[Date "2005.02.26"]
[Round "1"]
[White "Elston"]
[Black "Wulebgr"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[ECO "A57"]
[WhiteElo "1938"]
[BlackElo "1493"]
[Annotator "Wulebgr"]
[PlyCount "138"]
[EventDate "2005.02.21"]
1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 c5 3. d5 b5 4. Nf3 g6 5. cxb5 a6 6. Qc2 d6 (6... Nxd5 $5 7.
Qxc5 Qc7 8. Qxc7 Nxc7) 7. e4 Nbd7 8. Nc3 Bg7 9. Be2 $146 O-O 10. O-O axb5 11.
Bxb5 Ba6 12. Bd2 Qb6 $146 13. a4 Rfb8 14. h3 Rb7 15. Be3 Qc7 16. b3 Ne8 (16...
Nxe4 $5 17. Bxa6 Nxc3 18. Bxb7 Qxb7 19. Bg5 Nxd5 {
gives black better chances than the line played}) 17. Bxa6 Rxa6 18. Rab1 Qb8
19. Nd2 Nc7 20. f4 Qd8 21. Rfd1 Ra8 22. Nc4 Na6 {Still hoping to get this
knight to d6, I failed to anticipate Elston's sacrifice.} 23. Nb5 Nc7 {
Now I want to trade knights and weaken his pawns. Alas, Elston had anotheridea.
} 24. Ncxd6 $1 {Diagram #} exd6 25. Nxd6 Rb4 26. Bxc5 Nxc5 27. Qxc5 Na6 28. Qc6
Rb6 {This skewer gives me two pieces for four passed pawns.} ({
I might have tried} 28... Bd4+ 29. Kh1 Be3) 29. Nxf7 ({Fritz likes} 29. Nb7)
29... Kxf7 {Diagram # Fritz (the materialist) assures me that black is
winning. I thought I had some chances, but found white's pawns a bit
terrifying. The clock was my ally: Elston was under 20 minutes to my hour.} 30.
Qc4 Rc8 31. Qe2 Nc7 (31... Nb4) 32. Qg4 Rb4 33. Qf3 Ne8 (33... Bd4+ {
may have been my last chance for an advantage.}) 34. e5 Qh4 35. d6 {Diagram #}
Nf6 ({I considered} 35... Rd8 {but it seemed wise to give back a piece and
diminish the strength of Elston's pawns.}) 36. d7 Rd8 37. exf6 Bxf6 38. Qd5+
Kg7 39. f5 {at this point Elston has five minutes left to my 35 minutes.} Rd4
40. Rxd4 Bxd4+ 41. Kh1 Bf6 42. fxg6 hxg6 43. Rd1 Qf4 44. Qf3 Qc7 45. Rf1 Rf8 (
45... Qd6) 46. Qd5 Rf7 47. d8=Q Bxd8 (47... Qxd8 48. Qxd8 Bxd8 49. Rxf7+ Kxf7)
48. Rxf7+ Qxf7 49. Qxf7+ ({better is} 49. Qxd8 Qf1+ 50. Kh2 Qf4+ 51. Kg1 Qe3+
52. Kf1 Qf4+ 53. Ke2 Qe4+ 54. Kd1 Qb1+ 55. Kd2 Qxb3 56. Qd7+ {
and white will win}) 49... Kxf7 50. Kg1 Ba5 (50... Ke6) 51. Kf2 Ke6 52. Ke3 Ke5
53. g3 Bb4 54. h4 {Diagram #} Bc5+ $2 (54... Be1 55. Kf3 Kd5 $11) 55. Kf3 {
and now it is only a matter of time} Kf6 {a bad move in a bad position} (55...
Be7) 56. Ke4 Bf2 57. Kf4 (57. a5 $1) 57... Bc5 58. g4 Bd6+ 59. Ke4 Bb4 60. h5
Bf8 (60... g5 {and Elston might have asked for a draw due to insufficient
losing chances, or so he said after the game.}) 61. hxg6 Kxg6 62. Kd4 Kf6 63.
a5 Bd6 64. Kd5 Ke7 65. a6 Bb8 66. b4 Kd7 67. b5 Kc7 68. g5 Kb6 69. g6 Ka7 {
Elston's flag fell. We used an analog clock. With a time delay, white wins
easily.} 1/2-1/2
13 Jul 06
Originally posted by Essex 3The FIDE rule is agreed as being absolutely correct but in the circumstances I have outlined the moves were not being recorded so a valid position could not be constructed and the next round needed nto start so the clocks could not have been put back.
I suggest that articles 7.4 and 6 .14 of the FIDE Laws are the one's which would apply during a normally timed game; but a lightning event
may well have it's own rules.
7.4 If during a game it is found that an illegal move, including failing to meet the requirements of the promotion of a pawn or capturing the opponent`s king, has been completed, the p ...[text shortened]... other ideas may prevail.irregularity. The clocks shall be adjusted according to Article 6.14.
Bit of a conundrum really!