Originally posted by GolubIn my opinion-and my scores prove it-declining the gambit is a MAJOR error, just awful. Against the Falkbeer I don't know my score, but I do know that I rarely face it and thus don't have a great knowledge of the lines. So now I'm going to go look some of them over.
1. e4 e5 2. f4 d5
is a nice way of handling the KG
I think you can also accept the pawn and hang on to it, just needs some accurate play.. The only thing I wouldn't do is the decline the pawn (ie 2.. d6) because then white probably has an easy game.
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Originally posted by cmsMasterIt is my intention to try 2. d5 when next facing the K G as black
In my opinion-and my scores prove it-declining the gambit is a MAJOR error, just awful. Against the Falkbeer I don't know my score, but I do know that I rarely face it and thus don't have a great knowledge of the lines. So now I'm going to go look some of them over.
For now (in the current tournament) I can only play 3. d5
Originally posted by cmsMasterYes, that's exactly what I mean. You must accept it. But, the falkbeer is the one I was recommended by the few 2100+ players that I know IRL..
In my opinion-and my scores prove it-declining the gambit is a MAJOR error, just awful. Against the Falkbeer I don't know my score, but I do know that I rarely face it and thus don't have a great knowledge of the lines. So now I'm going to go look some of them over.
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Originally posted by Dragon FireOh god, 3...d5 is the most annoying thing in the world! That's the last thing a KG player should use as black! It's lame, it's not sharp enough, I just hate it 🙁. It's not even the best defense (IMO) it's just an annoying move.
It is my intention to try 2. d5 when next facing the K G as black
For now (in the current tournament) I can only play 3. d5
EDIT: Ok fine, it's good, and does lead to interesting lines BUT I don't have much experience against it, and if I play you I'll be playing the 3.Bc4 line. 🙂
Originally posted by cmsMasterTry Game 2401934 my first ever game playing 3. d5 as black.
Oh god, 3...d5 is the most annoying thing in the world! That's the last thing a KG player should use as black! It's lame, it's not sharp enough, I just hate it 🙁. It's not even the best defense (IMO) it's just an annoying move.
EDIT: Ok fine, it's good, and does lead to interesting lines BUT I don't have much experience against it, and if I play you I'll be playing the 3.Bc4 line. 🙂
2 more on going with same move. Beware!
Originally posted by Dragon FireOh god, what was white doing there?! Anyhow, I'd probably have chosen the exd5 variation to avoid the strong 4...g5. However, before you even get to 3...d5 I'll play 3.Bc4 for two reasons. 1.You don't know a lot about it. 2.It seems quite strong to me, and people that don't know how to play against it often chose inferior lines (like the 3...Qh4+ line).
Try Game 2401934 my first ever game playing 3. d5 as black.
2 more on going with same move. Beware!
Originally posted by cmsMaster3. .. Nf6 seems to be the best reply for black when after
Oh god, what was white doing there?! Anyhow, I'd probably have chosen the exd5 variation to avoid the strong 4...g5. However, before you even get to 3...d5 I'll play 3.Bc4 for two reasons. 1.You don't know a lot about it. 2.It seems quite strong to me, and people that don't know how to play against it often chose inferior lines (like the 3...Qh4+ line).
4. Nc3 .. c6 guarantees black a good position according to Bogoljubow, and confirmed by Korchnoi. Who am I to argue?
Originally posted by Dragon FireHeh, yeah, you know your stuff, but how often have you actually played against it? I figured you knew the mainline because I've posted it on these forums multiple times and Bedlam offered some help in the KG forum.
3. .. Nf6 seems to be the best reply for black when after
4. Nc3 .. c6 guarantees black a good position according to Bogoljubow, and confirmed by Korchnoi. Who am I to argue?
Originally posted by cmsMasterActually not often. I've been playing OTB in league and tournament for 35 years and very rarely do people play the Kings Gambit. In fact if I meet it once a year from about 50 OTB games I'd be surprised.
Heh, yeah, you know your stuff, but how often have you actually played against it? I figured you knew the mainline because I've posted it on these forums multiple times and Bedlam offered some help in the KG forum.
Besides this tournament I've only faced the KG once as black on RHP. I didn't play internet chess ever before July.
but I learn fast, have some good books, understand tactics and strategy and just can't resist sharp (unsound) lines that befuddle my opponent.
Originally posted by Dragon FireHere in Game 2316971 is an example of 2.Nf3 Be7 being a viable choice.
OK it IS (possibly) a viable continuation. It is the Cunningham Gambit. I just don't like it for black and User 256028 keeps losing with it so it is not viable for him.
However I quote from Korchnoi "it is not simple for black to achieve equality with this move"
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I didn't want to search through the enitre thread but I have heard a good response is 1.e4 e5 2.f4 Qh4+ which forces 3.g3 and further accentuates the weakness in the kingside, and because the pawn cannot move backward that weakness will exist the entire game. Black should then retreat the queen to e7 and mount a kingside attack on the light squares.
1.e4 e5 2.f4 Qh3+ 3.g3 Qe7 4.Nf3 exf4 5.gxf4
Originally posted by thesonofsaulAny line is viable if there a blunder as whites 27th move was.
Here in Game 2316971 is an example of 2.Nf3 Be7 being a viable choice.
I stand by Korchnois assessment that this line is not particularly good for black.
Originally posted by ChessJesterHear this on FICS? Yeah, that lecture's very one sided, and in all of my KG games I can't recall seeing that move once, although I'm sure it's quite playable.
I didn't want to search through the enitre thread but I have heard a good response is 1.e4 e5 2.f4 Qh4+ which forces 3.g3 and further accentuates the weakness in the kingside, and because the pawn cannot move backward that weakness will exist the entire game. Black should then retreat the queen to e7 and mount a kingside attack on the light squares.
1.e4 e5 2.f4 Qh3+ 3.g3 Qe7 4.Nf3 exf4 5.gxf4
Originally posted by Dragon FireDo you have a reference (preferably on the internet) examining this opinion? I don't mean to defend the move as I've only played it a couple of times myself. I am merely curious and don't have the time to go through hundreds of games and lines to figure it out for myself.
Any line is viable if there a blunder as whites 27th move was.
I stand by Korchnois assessment that this line is not particularly good for black.
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Originally posted by thesonofsaulPage 58 of Korchnoi/Zak "The Kings Gambit" published by Batsford states
Do you have a reference (preferably on the internet) examining this opinion? I don't mean to defend the move as I've only played it a couple of times myself. I am merely curious and don't have the time to go through hundreds of games and lines to figure it out for myself.
"This defense .... was for a very long time considered not totally correct...... recent research reveals that it is not simple for black to achieve equality with this [Be7] move" In none of the lines that follow are there any variations where (except if white did not play the best move) black achieves an advantage.
Having said this I have found that some of the assessments given in this book (first published in 1974) are not totally correct.
For example Game 2277047 which I have posted before followed a line that was lost for black yet subsequently with the aid of this forum and fritz we found better moves that could have won for black.
Also Game 2439096 whites 9th move [Bxf4]was annotated as bad for white. However having preciously been caught out on it I had found some improvements and think I now stand considerably better in this game.
Opinions differ and GMs do find improvements on long discarded lines so maybe Be7 has some merit. In any case we do not all play like GMs.