17 Aug 06
Originally posted by BigDoggProblemIf Kasparov played a top cc player he'd most probably beat him at cc and OTB.
The difference between Kasparov and a correspondence master is that Kasparov consults his books and databases a few minutes before the games, whereas the corr. guy can do it during the games.
Funny how you won't criticize Hydra for accessing books and databases during the game. Seriously, how well do you think it would manage the opening wit ...[text shortened]... d with your dollars, Mr. John Q. Spectator). OTB chess is soooo much purer than CC. 🙄🙄🙄
I doubt that he would be allowed to get advice from his seconds during an in-progress game OTB, apart from during intervals.
18 Aug 06
Originally posted by Sicilian SmaugYou have to be more objective than that. Pointing out the weaknesses of something does not mean you are against it. We all know what happens to your chess once you play too much blitz - your skills are seriously eroded. There is no evidence to suggest the superhuman feat of playing 100 simultaneous CC games improves you as a chess player one single bit, otherwise I would be pleased if you can show me such CC stars who also produce outstanding results at OTB chess.
If you are so agaisnt Correspondance chess, which allows for the use of books and databases, then why are you on this site?
18 Aug 06
Originally posted by z00tAs I said before, is playing around 100 moves a week a superhuman effort? And you are still defining a chessplayer as someone who plays Classical chess. Correspondence chess players are still chessplayers. And it would be hard to deny that playing correspondence chess improves your correspondence chess skills.
You have to be more objective than that. Pointing out the weaknesses of something does not mean you are against it. We all know what happens to your chess once you play too much blitz - your skills are seriously eroded. There is no evidence to suggest the superhuman feat of playing 100 simultaneous CC games improves you as a chess player one single bit, otherwi ...[text shortened]... d be pleased if you can show me such CC stars who also produce outstanding results at OTB chess.
18 Aug 06
Originally posted by BigDoggProblemSo that the CC player can do what Arno Nickel did against Hydra? See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arno_Nickel You will note that ICC is silent on engine use and Arno Nickel himself promotes the use of programs. Furthermore the lack of Arno Nickel's prowess in OTB chess suggests that its his engine(s) which do his talking.
I'd be interested in seeing that matchup. I'm not so sure Kaspy would prevail in a CC match...
Why wouldn't you like to see any self-respecting top CC player causing a stur in OTB chess, is it that the "assistance" in CC nullifies chess knowledge completely? Or is it withdrawal symptoms?
18 Aug 06
Originally posted by z00tNickel's method might be the only way to beat comps like Hydra. In any case, it seems that he was open about the fact that he intended to consult engines himself.
So that the CC player can do what Arno Nickel did against Hydra? See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arno_Nickel You will note that ICC is silent on engine use and Arno Nickel himself promotes the use of programs. Furthermore the lack of Arno Nickel's prowess in OTB chess suggests that its his engine(s) which do his talking.
Why wouldn't you like to see any sel ...[text shortened]... t the "assistance" in CC nullifies chess knowledge completely? Or is it withdrawal symptoms?
I doubt that Nickel's engine was as strong as Hydra. If so, his contribution to the victory can't be so easily shrugged off.
I'm not as interested in seeing centaur vs. comp as human vs. human. A match with Kaspy vs. a top CC player would only interest me if there were no engine use (books and databases are OK, though).
20 Aug 06
Originally posted by XanthosNZYeah, who cares if high-jumpers use a pole sometimes? At least it appears to make them 'jump' higher. [And anyway they are allowed to - just wish they didn't claim to be better jumpers]
You know what I hate? Authors who use spellcheckers and online thesauruses while writing their books. If I wanted to read a computer I would read a computer! It's clear from reading their handwritten notes that the spellchecker is the one doing the writing.
20 Aug 06
Originally posted by Dr StrangeloveYou know what is an injustice? Using several programs, databases, opening books and achieving a GM title in CC chess when you are only a 1500 at OTB chess. Gee even someone who doesn't know the basics can be an instant GM, just by feeding the moves into an engine/db. Isn't this passing the results of someone else as their own?
Yeah, who cares if high-jumpers use a pole sometimes? At least it appears to make them 'jump' higher. [And anyway they are allowed to - just wish they didn't claim to be better jumpers]
I'll bet 2 cpus and 4 GB of ram with an engine costing less than £100 can produce the sort of results of an ICC GM. WoW, now that is something. Wait a minute, the World Open fellows used a regular engine without any Z-series or special break-the-bank-server.
Any wonder the guiness book of records would not be amused? What would happen if one guy used an IBM mainframe and the other guy used a £300 laptop? Is it a question of who has the bigger resources or what?
21 Aug 06
There is a thread in the Only Chess forum on the weakness of CC players in OTB chess. This thread is supposed to be about the abuse of our hospitality by non-playing members who limit their contributions to the forum only.
There is another possibility, they could be bots like the annoying spam bots that seek your email address and fill it with junk mail.
22 Aug 06
Originally posted by Sicilian SmaugI think he means ICCF, not ICC.
You are wrong. Any player with GM next to their name on ICC is a real GM. ICC check with FIDE and if they are not a Master OTB then no title on ICC.
Also the use of engines is against ICC's rules UNLESS that engine is labelled with a C (for computer) SO everyone is aware if they are playing an engine or not - anyone found to be using an engine without being labelled with a C is subject to removal from the site, same as RHP.