@sonship: The trinity doctrine and salvation

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
I already know what Jehovahs Witnesses believe....

How does you stating this about yourself submit what you believe to scrutiny and discussion and comparison?

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
It belongs here, this thread is about salvation. But if you are feeling uneasy about having your beliefs questioned its ok, I will desist.

I'm not uneasy about discussing my beliefs now nor in any thread since I've started posting here in 2008. I think you would like to think you are making me uneasy.

I'm more interested in doctrinal qualifications for salvation/eternal life, whatever you want to call it. Your organisation has qualifiers, one which I often ask you about is "do I need to become a Jehovah's
Witness in order to be eligible for you version of eternal life?"
You generally avoid answering for some reason.

Originally posted by Rajk999
I certainly dont understand everything about God. Did I give you that impression?

One the contrary Trinitarians liken God to water, ice etc in an attempt to further explain what the Bible does not clearlyh say .. hence they think they know more than the Bible.

I dont liken God or Christ to any such thing. God is the Father, Christ is the son. end of story.

So do you believe Jesus is God?

Yes or no.

Originally posted by divegeester
I'm not uneasy about discussing my beliefs now nor in any thread since I've started posting here in 2008. I think you would like to think you are making me uneasy.

I'm more interested in doctrinal qualifications for salvation/eternal life, whatever you want to call it. Your organisation has qualifiers, one which I often ask you about is "do I need to ...[text shortened]... o be eligible for you version of eternal life?"
You generally avoid answering for some reason.

I already know what I believe but I was more interested in what you profess and why.

Clearly you were uneasy about expressing it I suspect because of its extra Biblical roots ( there is no once saved always saved doctrine in the Bible) and that is why you attempted to deflect attention by stating that it should be discussed in another thread and by making references to Jehovahs Witnesses in the hope that this too will draw attention away elsewhere.

Originally posted by FMF
How does you stating this about yourself submit what you believe to scrutiny and discussion and comparison?

Who is saying that it does? I am certainly not which means the only person saying so must be you. Surely you know why you are saying these things unless of course you are out of your senses?

Originally posted by leunammi
So do you believe Jesus is God?

Yes or no.

I am a disciple of Christ and as such I believe as the disciples believed. I particularly like the way Simon Peter expresses it and the way Jesus responds to Peter.

Who did the disciples say Jesus was?
He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am? And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God. And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven. (Matthew 16:15-17 KJV)

Whose teachings did the disciples follow ?
Then said Jesus unto the twelve, Will ye also go away? Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life. And we believe and are sure that thou art that Christ, the Son of the living God. (John 6:67-69 KJV)

Its good enough for the disciples and its good enough for me.

Originally posted by Rajk999
I am a disciple of Christ and as such I believe as the disciples believed. I particularly like the way Simon Peter expresses it and the way Jesus responds to Peter.

Who did the disciples say Jesus was?
He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am? And Simon Peter answered and said, [b]Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God. And Jesus ans ...[text shortened]... God.[/b] (John 6:67-69 KJV)

Its good enough for the disciples and its good enough for me.[/b]

Why can't you just answer the question? Saying you believe as the disciples believe is not an answer to my question at all, your answer may be more like .... 'well maybe', I don't know.

Can you answer yes or no? Surely someone as knowledgeable as you seem to be about the bible can answer such a fundamental question, come on now, don't dodge it.

Is Jesus God? Yes or no.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
Who is saying that it does? I am certainly not which means the only person saying so must be you. Surely you know why you are saying these things unless of course you are out of your senses?

Do you believe that the way you conduct yourself and the things you say here on this Spirituality Forum forms part of your ministry as a follower of Christ?

Originally posted by Rajk999
Paul tells Christians saints at Ephesus : For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: (Ephesians 2:8 KJV). This is the standard verse used by Christians to show that they have eternal life.

However, later on Paul says to these same Christian saints that they will get eternal life IF they are obedient ...[text shortened]...

It appears to me that 'saved by grace' does not equal 'eternal life in the Kingdom of God.'

If 'saved by grace' does not equal 'eternal life' 'then what does it mean'? Was Paul talking about two totally different subjects? If so what is the difference? If not, did Paul make a mistake, or forgot to qualify his statement?

Originally posted by leunammi
Why can't you just answer the question? Saying you believe as the disciples believe is not an answer to my question at all, your answer may be more like .... 'well maybe', I don't know.

Can you answer yes or no? Surely someone as knowledgeable as you seem to be about the bible can answer such a fundamental question, come on now, don't dodge it.

Is Jesus God? Yes or no.

I did answer the question. Jesus is the Son of God.

Originally posted by leunammi
If 'saved by grace' does not equal 'eternal life' 'then what does it mean'? Was Paul talking about two totally different subjects? If so what is the difference? If not, did Paul make a mistake, or forgot to qualify his statement?

I referred to two passages in Ephesians. One about saved by grace and one about entering the Kingdom of God.

Please make an effort and read it for yourself instead of asking me every question that comes to your head.

Originally posted by Rajk999
I did answer the question. Jesus is the Son of God.

Pertaining to Jesus, the two of us can understand the term 'son' to mean a different thing, it could mean something different in the bible.

To you, does Jesus = God?

Originally posted by FMF
Do you believe that the way you conduct yourself and the things you say here on this Spirituality Forum forms part of your ministry as a follower of Christ?

what are you talking about? I think you must have lost your marbles. This thread is about salvation. Look its in the title. What a cheap gimmick to attempt to make the debate personal with references to irrelevancies concerning the main topic. Do you also wear a chest wig and sport a gold medallion?

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
what are you talking about? I think you must have lost your marbles. This thread is about salvation.

I asked you about your concept of "salvation". As for what I am talking about, it's this: is the way you conduct yourself on this forum - and the way you are interacting with me right now on this thread in response to my query about your beliefs regarding "salvation" - is it all part of your ministry as a follower of Christ?