A Jehovah's Witness contradiction or plain hypocrisy?

Originally posted by galveston75
It's funny but sometimes a movie or TV show will come out that shows some future idealic, peaceful utopia type of world with all getting along with no crime, injustice, hunger, etc, and most seem to like those type of societies because of the peace and unity among all that is there.
But yet, it is so terrible when the JW's are working for that now by f ...[text shortened]... s because they have some other motive in their life and do not want to live under God's ways....

Often the surface of those utopian societies is peeled back to reveal sinister forces at work. Other episodes reveal strict conformity and outcast heroic rebel groups.

There are a number of such tropes at

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/search_result.php?cx=partner-pub-6610802604051523%3Aamzitfn8e7v&cof=FORID%3A10&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=utopia

or if that doesn't work, by searching on utopia at

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/HomePage

Example:

quote:

False Utopia
You live in a place that can only appear in the most beautiful dreams. The world is perfect, all is well, everyone is happy...

...or so you think. Your cozy little world is not as perfect as it seems. It never was. You just haven’t noticed yet.

A False Utopia is a place, town, or even a world that seems or at least is supposed to have no faults, while in reality it just hides them very carefully from its inhabitants. Many False Utopias are Dystopias in disguise (addressing the 0% Approval Rating aspect of Dystopia Is Hard), but not all; it's enough to try or pretend to be perfect, but always fall short, simply because perfection isn’t part of real life.

A False Utopia can manifest itself in these ways:

The world is obviously flawed or even a living Hell, but its people don’t know it (whether because they are lied to, kept in the dark, brainwashed, or are actually stupid) and don’t even notice their happiness is fake.
It looks perfect at first, then after a while living in it, the protagonist discovers that it isn’t, and often, the means that brought the Utopia to life are questionable. Often a big sign is finding out the truth about someone who's been Released to Elsewhere.
The whole utopia is too good to be true. So good it is not true: it’s only a dream, an illusion, or a scam.

Look out!!! Many False Utopias are meant to stay secret, so expect heavy spoilers on this trope!

A False Utopia is often a Crapsaccharine World. Contrast Crapsack World, where the world is Hell but everybody usually knows. If it's a suburb town, it's Stepford Suburbia.

unquote

Originally posted by galveston75
I did just as God told me to do. And guess what? Did she run away and tell us to go to hell? Hardly my friend. The punishment did exactly as Jehovah designed it and it woke her up spiritually and now is married to a wonderfully spiritually strong man and is actually doing better then anyone in the entire famliy. She would rather die then to miss a meetin ...[text shortened]... t the exception as most that are disfellowshipped do return and do better spiritually then ever.

There are millions of ex JWs who will never return to your church, all of them would have been shunned, so I don't see how your claim that most return stacks up.

Originally posted by JS357
The problem with "sexual immorality" as a label is that it seems to imply sex for sex sake. But the situation often brings true love to people who are in loveless relationships. The decision to discontinue a deep emotional relationship and return to one that is dry and cold, can be the issue, it's not just wanting the sex. I hope elders have training in these ...[text shortened]... y be duty bound to insist on termination of the relationship and reunion with the spouse if any.

Believe me it is never automatic by any means. Every elder has experiance and has been exposed to almost every situation. The bottom line is NO elder wants anyone to be disfellowshipped.
If an elder were to unjustly disfellowship someone and that is brought out by God, that elder will have to answer to God as we all do.
The Bible warns elders or those in the lead to be very careful of the position God gave them and if it is abused, they will answer to God.

Originally posted by JS357
Often the surface of those utopian societies is peeled back to reveal sinister forces at work. Other episodes reveal strict conformity and outcast heroic rebel groups.

There are a number of such tropes at

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/search_result.php?cx=partner-pub-6610802604051523%3Aamzitfn8e7v&cof=FORID%3A10&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=utopia

or if that doesn't ...[text shortened]... is Hell but everybody usually knows. If it's a suburb town, it's Stepford Suburbia.

unquote

I'm just talking of humanity and what they portray as omething good but yet condemn us for trying.
And yes anything that was designed by MAN will never work. Only something directed by GOD will ever work.

Originally posted by divegeester
There are millions of ex JWs who will never return to your church, all of them would have been shunned, so I don't see how your claim that most return stacks up.

Sorry you don't. But you know as well as everyone here it doesn't matter what we might show you, does it? Of course not.

Originally posted by galveston75
Sorry you don't. But you know as well as everyone here it doesn't matter what we might show you, does it? Of course not.

You didn't "show" anything, you just made a misrepresentation of the fact that millions of people have left your church, all would have been shunned and none have returned. Your claim that most who are shunned return is you deliberately misrepresenting the facts.

Galveston, leaving the Jehovah's Witness organisation is not a sin, it is not apostasy and it is not in anyway justifiable to encourage members of their family to shun them for it. It is a horrendous thing to do to someone who simply disagrees with you.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
too right, they have become like the sow who was cleaned up and then returned to the mire! they have set a bad example by their conduct and are rightly disfellowshipped! Peter mentions the very fact,

The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire. 2 Peter 2:22.

how will you explain that? they are once again touching the unclean thing, Babalyon the great, ouch.

If that is the case how do you explain the quote in the OP?

Originally posted by Proper Knob
If that is the case how do you explain the quote in the OP?

I noticed that, but it's difficult to keep up with all the hemming and hawing.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
So it takes an atheist to acknowledge that disfellowshipping is scriptural, shame on those who profess to be Christians, putting bad for good and good for bad! As to your question PK,

2 John 1:10

New International Version
If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not take them into your house or welcome them.

New Living ...[text shortened]... ceive him not into the house, and say not to him, 'Hail!'

http://biblehub.com/2_john/1-10.htm

So, why do you bother going house to house again? You are "bringing not this doctrine", and so people should "receive him not into your house", right? Thanks for clearing that up robbie.

Originally posted by Suzianne
So, why do you bother going house to house again? You are "bringing not this doctrine", and so people should "receive him not into your house", right? Thanks for clearing that up robbie.

we search for unicorns, lost unicorns of the Lord.

Originally posted by Proper Knob
If that is the case how do you explain the quote in the OP?

there is no contradiction as far as I can see, the Bible is clear on the matter, you leave and start teaching something else you are an apostate, we can hardly rejoice at someone becoming an apostate and we have the scriptural right to disfellowship them. On the other hand when someone becomes a witness and repents of their sinful life we have a cause to rejoice, no contradiction, its just sore loosers that like to try and make out there is, so sad for them.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
there is no contradiction as far as I can see, the Bible is clear on the matter.

No contradiction? Explain how there is 'no contradiction'.

Originally posted by Proper Knob
No contradiction? Explain how there is 'no contradiction'.

I did, see the edited text.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
lets here those who prefer to proffer their own opinions instead of scripture explain the following,

1 Corinthians 5:13

New International Version
God will judge those outside. "Expel the wicked person from among you."

New Living Translation
God will judge those on the outside; but as the Scriptures say, "You must remove the evil person fr ...[text shortened]... e; and put ye away the evil from among yourselves.

http://biblehub.com/1_corinthians/5-13.htm

This one is simple, even for a simpleton. The one your church (your pastor, your minister, your congregation) judges as "wicked" is not always wicked.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
there is no contradiction as far as I can see, the Bible is clear on the matter, you leave and start teaching something else you are an apostate, we can hardly rejoice at someone becoming an apostate and we have the scriptural right to disfellowship them.

How can the article claim -

"No one should be forced to worship in a way that he finds unacceptable or be made to choose between his beliefs and his family."

And yet apostates are to be shunned and will more than likely have to choose between their beliefs and family.