Originally posted by RJHinds(Revelation 6:2) And I saw, and look! a white horse, and the one seated on it had a bow; and a crown was given him, and he went out conquering and to complete his conquest.
I can see where you can get confused here. I believe the original shout must come from King Jesus Christ the Lord. Then the voice of the Archangel Michael as he commands the heavenly army to follow. Finally the last trumpet is sounded by the seventh angel mentioned also in Revelation 11.
Who else but the "King" Jesus Christ would have a crown? So it must be Jesus who is leading the Heavenly army to defeat Satan.
(Revelation 19:11) I saw heaven opened, and look! a white horse. And the one seated on it is called Faithful and True, and he judges and carries on war in righteousness.
This also id s Jesus.
This in harmony with (1 John 3:8b) For this purpose the Son of God was made manifest, to break up the works of the Devil.
and also (Genesis 3:15) And I will put enmity between you and the woman and between your offspring and her offspring. He will crush your head, and you will strike him in the heel.”
No doubt you would agree that the "He" foretold is Christ Jesus who would defeat Satan.
also, I know I mentioned it before but (Daniel 12:1) “During that time Miสนcha·el will stand up, the great prince who is standing in behalf of your people. And there will occur a time of distress such as has not occurred since there came to be a nation until that time. And during that time your people will escape, everyone who is found written down in the book."
shows that it is Michael who stands in behalf of God's people.
There is only one archangel in the Bible. That is Michael (who became Jesus the Christ). He leads God's army. It is his voice that calls the army to action.
19 Jan 15
Originally posted by roigamAre you intending to repeatedly ignore my posts so I have to call you out over it like a Galveston75 protege?
(Revelation 6:2) And I saw, and look! a white horse, and the one seated on it had a bow; and a crown was given him, and he went out conquering and to complete his conquest.
Who else but the "King" Jesus Christ would have a crown? So it must be Jesus who is leading the Heavenly army to defeat Satan.
(Revelation 19:11) I saw heaven opened, and look! a white h ...[text shortened]... ho became Jesus the Christ). He leads God's army. It is his voice that calls the army to action.
20 Jan 15
Originally posted by roigamHere you are, it was all the way back on the previous page ๐
I did respond to your bump. Perhaps I missed something else?? Just let me know if I did.
Originally posted by divegeester
Three points for you to consider[b] and respond to please:
Michael the archangel is only mentioned specifically by name 5 times in the Bible and never in association with being Jesus Christ.
1 Thes 4:16 also says that the LORD will return with the "trump of God". If you accept that the piece "with the the voice of the/an archangel" denotes that Jesus is the archangel Michael, will you also apply the same thinking and conclude that "the trump of God" denotes that Jesus is God? You will not of course, but I challenge you to consider this parallel and the veracity of the position you have been taught.
Also in Hebrews 1:5-13, look at this...
For to which of the angels did He ever say: “You are My Son, today I have begotten You”? And again: “I will be to Him a Father, and He shall be to Me a Son”? But when He again brings the firstborn into the world, He says: “Let all the angels of God worship Him.” And of the angels He says: “Who makes His angels spirits and His ministers a flame of fire.” But to the Son He says: “Your throne, O God, is forever and ever; a scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom. You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness; therefore God, Your God, has anointed You with the oil of gladness more than Your companions.” And: “You, Lord, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth, and the heavens are the work of Your hands. They will perish, but You remain; and they will all grow old like a garment; like a cloak You will fold them up, and they will be changed. But You are the same, and Your years will not fail.” But to which of the angels has He ever said: “Sit at My right hand, till I make Your enemies Your footstool”?
Paul is clearly calling out the challenge that God has never said these things to any angel.
What do you think of my three points?[/b]
21 Jan 15
Originally posted by roigamThe Four Horses or Revelation 6 reveals the last day events that leads up to the Great Tribulation. The Lamb is Jesus Christ who breaks open the seven-sealed scroll.
(Revelation 6:2) And I saw, and look! a white horse, and the one seated on it had a bow; and a crown was given him, and he went out conquering and to complete his conquest.
Who else but the "King" Jesus Christ would have a crown? So it must be Jesus who is leading the Heavenly army to defeat Satan.
(Revelation 19:11) I saw heaven opened, and look! a white h ...[text shortened]... ho became Jesus the Christ). He leads God's army. It is his voice that calls the army to action.
I believe the revealing of the White Horse and Rider is first, because it is the prominent feature that begins the endtimes events leading right in to the tribulations of those days. This Rider on the White Horse is the spirit of the Antichrist or the Mahdi, savior of Islam, who rides in peacefully with a bow, signifying a position of strength, but with no arrows, so that he can deceive Israel into thinking he has peaceful intentions. So he is given a crown and declared King for his ability to negotiate peaceful agreements and goes about conguering and conquering by the deception of peace.
The peace from the White Horseman is short lived, because the Jihad spirit of the Red Horse is unleased by which they kill each other because of their sharia law and inability to remain peaceful with each other and because of their hatred of Israel and Christians. So they are gathered to go to war against Israel causing great shedding of blood by war, which is symbolized by the great sword.
But before these two Horsemen can finish their ride, a Black Horse and Rider is unleashed that is another demonic spirit of Islam with the intentions of toppling the economic systems of the Capitalist Christians and Jews by attacking their commerce. All this leads to economic hardship for those not having the ability to buy and sell throught the mark of the beast empire of Islam. However, they are not allowed to harm the servants of God, symbolized by the oil and wine.
Then finally, the Pale Green Horse and rider represents the full release of the Islamic demon spirits to wreak havoc in the Great tribulation period with all four horsemen riding with the intent to conquer Israel and the whole world with every means possible. Satan's wrath is now fully unleashed at this time through the Islamic beast empire.
21 Jan 15
Originally posted by RJHindsExcept for the part where Revelations was not religious in nature, it was a tract aimed at the hated Romans. It had nothing to do with all that religious BS attributed to it later.
The Four Horses or Revelation 6 reveals the last day events that leads up to the Great Tribulation. The Lamb is Jesus Christ who breaks open the seven-sealed scroll.
I believe the revealing of the White Horse and Rider is first, because it is the prominent feature that begins the endtimes events leading right in to the tribulations of those days. This R ...[text shortened]... ns possible. Satan's wrath is now fully unleashed at this time through the Islamic beast empire.
You should really do the research into this subject. It became part of the bible only at the insistence of Athanasius who was deposed several times but ended up shaping what the NT became.
http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2012/03/31/four-big-myths-about-the-book-of-revelation/
22 Jan 15
Originally posted by sonhouseAs Suzianne pointed out, an atheist attempting to teach something to a Christian about the Holy Bible is absurd.
Except for the part where Revelations was not religious in nature, it was a tract aimed at the hated Romans. It had nothing to do with all that religious BS attributed to it later.
You should really do the research into this subject. It became part of the bible only at the insistence of Athanasius who was deposed several times but ended up shaping what ...[text shortened]... ecame.
http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2012/03/31/four-big-myths-about-the-book-of-revelation/
22 Jan 15
Originally posted by sonhouseLol... myths... yeah, okay.
Except for the part where Revelations was not religious in nature, it was a tract aimed at the hated Romans. It had nothing to do with all that religious BS attributed to it later.
You should really do the research into this subject. It became part of the bible only at the insistence of Athanasius who was deposed several times but ended up shaping what ...[text shortened]... ecame.
http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2012/03/31/four-big-myths-about-the-book-of-revelation/
The book of Revelation is about the last days of this system of things. The things which must come to pass leading up to the return of Jesus Christ. Ignore it at your peril.
22 Jan 15
Originally posted by sonhouseI don't see any proof of your claims in this article. All I see is Pagels says this and Pagels says that. Then the article ends with the following:
Except for the part where Revelations was not religious in nature, it was a tract aimed at the hated Romans. It had nothing to do with all that religious BS attributed to it later.
You should really do the research into this subject. It became part of the bible only at the insistence of Athanasius who was deposed several times but ended up shaping what ...[text shortened]... ecame.
http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2012/03/31/four-big-myths-about-the-book-of-revelation/
Even after writing a book about it, Pagels has hardly mastered its meaning.
“The book is the hardest one in the Bible to understand,” Pagels says. “I don’t think anyone completely understands it.”
John Blake - CNN Writer
RJHinds says something else, so there, put that in your pipe and smoke it.
๐
23 Jan 15
Originally posted by divegeesterBump for roigam.
Here you are, it was all the way back on the previous page ๐
Originally posted by divegeester
[b]Three points for you to consider[b] and respond to please:
Michael the archangel is only mentioned specifically by name 5 times in the Bible and never in association with being Jesus Christ.
1 Thes 4:16 also says that the LORD w ...[text shortened]... that God has never said these things to any angel.
What do you think of my three points?[/b][/b]
24 Jan 15
Originally posted by RJHindsI think the nature and purpose ~ and credibility ~ of Revelation is quite an interesting topic actually, and not one that only those who interpret it in a certain way are entitled to examine. Did Athanasius have anything to do with Revelation being included in the canon, and if so, what might have been his reasons?
As Suzianne pointed out, an atheist attempting to teach something to a Christian about the Holy Bible is absurd.