"Choose Life"

@rajk999 said
Did someone say everybody was capable of keeping the commandments all the time?

The fact that you choose to focus on that means you do not want to keep any of the commandments any time.

You looking to get cast out....

Okay, now that you AGREE with the fact that nobody can obey at all times, here's the consequence:

That most people, whether a theist or an atheist, may choose life most of the time, but will ultimately make choices in their lives that equal death.

The Bible itself states that our human condition puts us in a NO WIN situation. We have free will, but choose death, which was started by Adam and Eve and their choice in the garden.

@ghost-of-a-duke said
Any confused Christian reading this, don't follow sonship down the cultist rabbit hole of thinking Jesus actually meant for you to eat him.

He was talking about 'belief' not cannibalism.

I believe He was talking about the Holy Communion, also known as the Lord’s Supper.

@pb1022 said
I believe He was talking about the Holy Communion, also known as the Lord’s Supper.

Sonship frequently talks about consuming Jesus, and not just in relation to the Lord's Supper. (It's a running joke).

@ghost-of-a-duke said
"life and death, the blessing and the curse: therefore choose life."

Life = The blessing
Death = The curse

That particular passage relates to the covenant God wished to establish with his people. (Who have to use their freewill to choose it, as opposed to life without God - death).

I attended church today, and the message was "choose life", which prompted this thread.

And as some sermons do, they bring a good message, but lack any real life examples of how exactly to put into practice what they are preaching.

It's easy to say "choose life", thus choose God, and most can probably succeed a good portion of the time, but it's lacking something: the reality that no matter who you are, you're likely to choose death many times in your life.

@chaney3 said
I attended church today, and the message was "choose life", which prompted this thread.

And as some sermons do, they bring a good message, but lack any real life examples of how exactly to put into practice what they are preaching.

It's easy to say "choose life", thus choose God, and most can probably succeed a good portion of the time, but it's lacking something: the reality that no matter who you are, you're likely to choose death many times in your life.

The passage not only wants you to believe in God, but to trust in Him. It asks you to willing enter into a covenant with God. But this is a 2 way street. You need to change your ways, follow God's commandments. Nobody said this would be an easy thing to do. You have to put in the effort, break bad habits.

@ghost-of-a-duke said
The passage not only wants you to believe in God, but to trust in Him. It asks you to willing enter into a covenant with God. But this is a 2 way street. You need to change your ways, follow God's commandments. Nobody said this would be an easy thing to do. You have to put in the effort, break bad habits.

I don’t believe self-effort is the way one breaks bad habits in the New Covenant. It’s done by realizing who you are in Christ and that you are no longer under condemnation. That breaks the power of sin over you.

The Apostle Paul wrote about that extensively, though I can’t remember off the top of my head which books.

But it’s similar in a way to what Jesus Christ said prior to the New Covenant about seeking first the Kingdom of God.

@ghost-of-a-duke said
The passage not only wants you to believe in God, but to trust in Him. It asks you to willing enter into a covenant with God. But this is a 2 way street. You need to change your ways, follow God's commandments. Nobody said this would be an easy thing to do. You have to put in the effort, break bad habits.

Understood.
But it's not possible 100% of the time.

Can we agree on that?

(Humans are inclined to use their free will for desires of the flesh, despite trying to obey God)

@chaney3 said
Understood.
But it's not possible 100% of the time.

Can we agree on that?

(Humans are inclined to use their free will for desires of the flesh, despite trying to obey God)

If it were possible 100% of the time, Jesus Christ wouldn’t have had to die on the cross.

But no one is justified by the law anyway.

“Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.”

(Galatians 2:16)

“But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.

Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.

But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.”

(Galatians 3:23-26)

You know how to spot a false doctrine like rajk999’s false doctrine a mile away? It puts your focus on yourself and not on Jesus.

@pb1022 said
I don’t believe self-effort is the way one breaks bad habits in the New Covenant. It’s done by realizing who you are in Christ and that you are no longer under condemnation. That breaks the power of sin over you.

The Apostle Paul wrote about that extensively, though I can’t remember off the top of my head which books.

But it’s similar in a way to what Jesus Christ said prior to the New Covenant about seeking first the Kingdom of God.

Shhh. I'm getting Chaney to change his bad habits.

@chaney3 said
Understood.
But it's not possible 100% of the time.

Can we agree on that?

(Humans are inclined to use their free will for desires of the flesh, despite trying to obey God)

Of course. None of us are perfect. (Well, very few of us).

@ghost-of-a-duke said
Of course. None of us are perfect. (Well, very few of us).

That means that everyone will choose death during their lifetime, as well as striving to choose life.

This battle is well known, as Paul describes.

I don't like when sermons sugarcoat the topic and neglect to discuss the reality of our human condition.

The sermon I want to hear is one that suggests we choose life, admit that it's not achievable all the time, and offers practical ways to fight the temptation to sin, even though we will knowingly choose sin anyway.

Does God want more than an effort?
Is trying acceptable?

I'm weary of hearing "hey, do good works", while omitting the fact that doing bad works is right around the corner. Life and decision making are more than a neat one liner.

@ghost-of-a-duke said
Shhh. I'm getting Chaney to change his bad habits.

Lol, I'm trying....really I am. 😀

@chaney3 said
That means that everyone will choose death during their lifetime, as well as striving to choose life.

This battle is well known, as Paul describes.

I don't like when sermons sugarcoat the topic and neglect to discuss the reality of our human condition.

The sermon I want to hear is one that suggests we choose life, admit that it's not achievable all the time, and of ...[text shortened]... doing bad works is right around the corner. Life and decision making are more than a neat one liner.

I think memorizing and reciting verses from the Holy Bible that are applicable to your weaknesses and temptations is a great place to start.

@pb1022 said
I think memorizing and reciting verses from the Holy Bible that are applicable to your weaknesses and temptations is a great place to start.

If we are to believe the account of Adam and Eve in Genesis, then here's what we know:

They were told NOT to eat from the tree of good and evil, but were allowed to eat from the tree of "life".....they did not choose life.

Our human condition is such that we are rebellious and choose death over life.

So it's curious that God would again instruct the people of Deuteronomy to choose life, perhaps in vain, knowing in advance (because He's God), that it's not possible.

That's likely why Jesus was necessary.

That means: we are going to continue to choose death over life, but can ask for forgiveness now.

The whole thing is messed up and bizarre if you ask me.

@chaney3 said
If we are to believe the account of Adam and Eve in Genesis, then here's what we know:

They were told NOT to eat from the tree of good and evil, but were allowed to eat from the tree of "life".....they did not choose life.

Our human condition is such that we are rebellious and choose death over life.

So it's curious that God would again instruct the people of Deutero ...[text shortened]... er life, but can ask for forgiveness now.

The whole thing is messed up and bizarre if you ask me.

I hear what you’re saying, but in the Adam and Eve account, I think you’re leaving out a key player, namely Satan.

I don’t believe either Adam or Eve would have disobeyed God had Satan not been there and persuaded Eve (with a lie) to eat from the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil (Carl Sagan referred to it as the Tree of Knowledge and said God wanted His creation to be ignorant, which is obviously false.)

But I agree we inherited our sin nature (rebellious nature) from Adam, and, as the old saying goes, We’re not sinners because we sin. We sin because we’re sinners.”

I think the Apostle Paul argued in Galatians that God never expected man to be able to keep the Mosaic Law to God’s standard of perfection - that the purpose of the Law was to show man his need for a Saviour, which is of course where Jesus Christ comes in.