08 Dec 10
1 edit
Originally posted by ZahlanziTunisia, Algeria, Morocco, Jordan, Uzbekistan, ...actually the list goes on. Not all as savory as one might wish but certainly savory enough to make nonesense of divegeester's "observation".
he isn't observant enough.
or better yet, those examples seriously mess up his argument so they are classified as "exceptions to the rule".
how dare you bring them up?
08 Dec 10
Originally posted by FabianFnasactually, no i don't care, for I am very well aware of how persons feel towards us, after all, i regularly meet them in the house to house ministry every week. Secondly, i did not write any of these articles, they are not my opinion, you may have failed to realise that making your statement rather silly, thirdly the Quran itself says nothing about killing a person because of blasphemy, so quite clearly those who try to perpetuate that it does are the worst kind of religious bigots, for they are projecting their ignorance onto others. If you would like to try to defend the use of blasphemy laws, comment upon any of the text that was supplied, then be my guest, otherwise, once again your comments are ill conceived and practically irrelevant to all intents and purposes. It is a now tiresome pattern that you must insist on making these ad hominen attacks.
Then you will at the same time accept that people don't respect the JW where you belong? Because, as I stated before, there are several reasons to disrespect JW, as you already know. Don't you care about that?
Don't treat others as you don't like to be treated yourself, as a wise man once said...
I think you should stop your crucade, based on your opinions, and nothing else.
08 Dec 10
Originally posted by robbie carrobieIt surprises me that you have studied the Quaran so much. Perhaps I should change my opinins about you...? 🙂
actually, no i don't care, for I am very well aware of how persons feel towards us, after all, i regularly meet them in the house to house ministry every week. Secondly, i did not write any of these articles, they are not my opinion, you may have failed to realise that making your statement rather silly, thirdly the Quran itself says nothing about k ...[text shortened]... urposes. It is a now tiresome pattern that you must insist on making these ad hominen attacks.
Any way, there are bigottery everywhere, especially among the fundamentalists, no matter religion. It is among them the real danger lies. Not among the everyday loving and caring believers of the religion at hand.
But looking at a few bad ones, and let them represent every on in the same religion is like saying "Hitler was bad, therefore every German is bad", and that we don't do, don't we?
Judging islam by an article you don't even stand by is not good retorics, no?
Judge the blasphemy laws, and I agree with you. Then it doesn't matter which religion, Islam or Christianity, who have them. Blasphemy laws lead to a teocratic society and from a democratic way of govern a country. Christianity's incvisitions didn't lead to any good, right? Condemn them, right? Christians can be awfully bad when looking at their history. Not the individuals, but the christian system.
08 Dec 10
Originally posted by FabianFnasFabian i have taken an interest in all religions since my youth, my best friend in college was a Muslim, its no big deal, however, this is not simply about a group of fundamentalists, these are laws enshrined in the state, a whole governing body. Even when they are not part of State Law as in the case of Iran, these laws are being superseded, indeed why should a person who wishes to change his religious conviction, be subject to death? as in the case of Iran? Who are perpetrating these murders? Is it Athiests? Catholics? or Muslims? If it is the latter why can we not say that the Islamic system as it stands, as conceived by, as enforced and perpetuated by Muslims is an abomination, why cant we?
It surprises me that you have studied the Quaran so much. Perhaps I should change my opinins about you...? 🙂
Any way, there are bigottery everywhere, especially among the fundamentalists, no matter religion. It is among them the real danger lies. Not among the everyday loving and caring believers of the religion at hand.
But looking at a few bad on ...[text shortened]... wfully bad when looking at their history. Not the individuals, but the christian system.
08 Dec 10
2 edits
Originally posted by robbie carrobieWell by your reckoning if someone comes along now and says these laws were only temporary...writes another book about it perhaps then things are all tickety-boo. Islam and Qu-ran is still infallible truth 🙄
Fabian i have taken an interest in all religions since my youth, my best friend in college was a Muslim, its no big deal, however, this is not simply about a group of fundamentalists, these are laws enshrined in the state, a whole governing body. Even when they are not part of State Law as in the case of Iran, these laws are being superseded, indeed ...[text shortened]... stands, as conceived by, as enforced and perpetuated by Muslims is an abomination, why cant we?
08 Dec 10
1 edit
Originally posted by AgergActually within the realm of Islam, this has already happened, that is what the original Satanic verses were about. The prophet, about to get his head kicked in by the Medinans, praised the deities of the place in an effort to save the situation, naturally this was blasphemous and the saying was later retracted and the supposition put in place that it was Satan who placed these words upon his lips. We find in this two ideas, that a prophet of God is somehow infallible, and two, that Islam holds the idea that what was previously held as sound can later be superseded by that which comes after.
Wll by your reckoning if some comes along now and says these laws were only temporary...writes another book about it perhaps then things are all tickety-boo. Islam is still infallible truth 🙄
You will often here Islamists state that not one word of the Quran has been changed, its nonsense, for one, how do they know, they have not the original copy and two, the so called Satanic verses clearly indicate that it has, and lastly even if it has not, there is nothing to show that its inspired, i mean, the daily mail has not been changed it hardly makes it inspired!
08 Dec 10
1 edit
Originally posted by robbie carrobieYou (not I) are forced to accept by your own reasoning that this is a perfectly valid means by which one can edit historical "documents" whilst preserving their integrity.
Actually within the realm of Islam, this has already happened, that is what the original Satanic verses were about. The prophet, about to get his head kicked in by the Medinans, praised the deities of the place in an effort to save the situation, naturally this was blasphemous and the saying was later retracted and the supposition put in place that it was Satan who placed these words upon his lips.
08 Dec 10
1 edit
Originally posted by AgergActually there is a difference, for we are not talking of changing text, as in the case of the Satanic verses, we are talking of agreements, that what the Mosaic law was, an agreement that was binding, it may be dissolved at any moment, this is entirely different from changing a text, i think that even you shall agree. No i dont think its valid.
You (not I) are forced to accept by your own reasoning that this is a perfectly valid means by which one can edit historical "documents" whilst preserving their integrity.
08 Dec 10
Originally posted by robbie carrobieAh yes I forgot - if it happens in any book other than the Bible then it is wrong; but if it is the Bible, then since it is the holy book you like best, anything goes! 🙄
Actually there is a difference, for we are not talking of changing text, as in the case of the Satanic verses, we are talking of agreements, that what the Mosaic law was, an agreement that was binding, it may be dissolved at any moment, this is entirely different from changing a text, i think that even you shall agree. No i dont think its valid.
08 Dec 10
Originally posted by robbie carrobieI am happy that you changed your opinion for a better one.
Fabian i have taken an interest in all religions since my youth, my best friend in college was a Muslim, its no big deal, however, this is not simply about a group of fundamentalists, these are laws enshrined in the state, a whole governing body. Even when they are not part of State Law as in the case of Iran, these laws are being superseded, indeed ...[text shortened]... stands, as conceived by, as enforced and perpetuated by Muslims is an abomination, why cant we?
08 Dec 10
Originally posted by Agergno all the spurious texts of the Bible have been identified, there are literally thousands of extant manuscripts, this is not the case with the Quran.
Ah yes I forgot - if it happens in any book other than the Bible then it is wrong; but if it is the Bible, then since it is the holy book you like best, anything goes! 🙄
