13 Mar 14
Originally posted by FabianfnasQ - By whom? A - Paul the Apostle
Why are you so sure there is a heaven at all? Has anyone returned from there and told us about it?
By whom? Of his own experience? Anyone who has been there and turned back?
...or just the good old answer - bible says so.
Originally posted by Grampy Bobby
Paul the Apostle; yes (and documented); no, though many were kicked out as the result of a prehistoric revolt.
Okay...
Q - Of his own experience? A - yes (and documented)
Okay... by reading the bible, or...? Please clarify.
Q - Anyone who has been there and turned back? A - no, though many were kicked out as the result of a prehistoric revolt.
So there are no turning back to convince anyone?
I know that there is a New York. I've been there, I've taken photographs, I've bought souvenirs.
I don't know anyone that has been in heaven and taking back anything from it. Well, perhaps LSD-hallucinations...
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13 Mar 14
Originally posted by Grampy Bobby"... in simple words a nine year old boy could clearly understand [Gospel Hearing...]'''"
Originally posted by JS357
" I definitely believe we have voluntary control over our beliefs as long as we're conscious and rational."
Thanks.
The above belief would be an example of direct doxastic voluntarism. 🙂
[i]Unless of course, while you were lacking that belief (if you ever did), you chose to go through experiences (studies, di ...[text shortened]... t was received as great news. I said: "Yes, Father; I do believe in your only Son Jesus Christ".
Google doesn't find (prominently, anyway, the term "Gospel Hearing" so I wonder if it is a special kind of hearing.
13 Mar 14
Originally posted by Grampy BobbyYour response is indecipherable. Is that intentionally so in order to avoid admiting the truth?
Your belief "That does not, to me, sound like you chose to believe.... was in fact forced upon you by the evidence or whatever else that caused this 'awareness' in you." after reading an accurate account of a young boy's discovery.
"In faith there is enough light for those who want to believe and enough shadows to blind those who don't." -Pascal
13 Mar 14
1 edit
Originally posted by JS357"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten [uniquely born] Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world; but that the world should be saved through Him. He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name [person] of the only begotten [uniquely born] Son of God." (John 3:16-18)
"... in simple words a nine year old boy could clearly understand [Gospel Hearing...]'''"
Google doesn't find (prominently, anyway, the term "Gospel Hearing" so I wonder if it is a special kind of hearing.
"Gospel: Good News. I heard it with both my auditory ears and right lobe as academic information;
thought about it a few days, I decided "yes" I believe in the Person and Work of Jesus Christ.
Edit Note: Could just as well have been visual had I read this information as an older person.
13 Mar 14
Originally posted by FabianFnasAn appointment to honor; I'll be back later tonight.
Q - By whom? A - Paul the Apostle
Okay...
Q - Of his own experience? A - yes (and documented)
Okay... by reading the bible, or...? Please clarify.
Q - Anyone who has been there and turned back? A - no, though many were kicked out as the result of a prehistoric revolt.
So there are no turning back to convince anyone?
I know that there is a New ...[text shortened]... ne that has been in heaven and taking back anything from it. Well, perhaps LSD-hallucinations...
13 Mar 14
1 edit
Originally posted by twhitehead... applies your assessment:
Then why the cryptic post? Why do you find it so difficult to give simple straight forward responses?
Originally posted by twhitehead
That does not, to me, sound like you chose to believe. The belief was in fact forced upon you by the evidence or whatever else that caused this 'awareness' in you. of my reply to JS:
"JS, my own pilgrim's progress went from a mild curiosity to an intensifying awareness of the possibility that an all knowing, powerful and knowable personal God existed and always did exist [God Consciousness] to an earnest desire to know Him if He did. Next I was given information similar to this thread's original post in simple words a nine year old boy could clearly understand [Gospel Hearing]; it was received as great news. I said: "Yes, Father; I do believe in your only Son Jesus Christ".
... to your assessment of mine (in your own words).i.,e., "whatever else that caused this 'awareness' in you." to him.
[Reset] What is your question?
Note: Must go; my ride is waiting.
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13 Mar 14
Originally posted by Grampy BobbyAh, is this a breakthrough in our communication?
"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten [uniquely born] Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world; but that the world should be saved through Him. He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, becau ...[text shortened]...
Edit Note: Could just as well have been visual had I read this information as an older person.
You say "I decided 'yes' I believe," not "I decided to believe."
Deciding that you believe something is different than deciding to believe something, in my book.
13 Mar 14
Originally posted by JS357Originally posted by JS357
Ah, is this a breakthrough in our communication?
You say "I decided 'yes' I believe," not "I decided to believe."
Deciding that you believe something is different than deciding to believe something, in my book.
Ah, is this a breakthrough in our communication?
You say "I decided 'yes' I believe," not "I decided to believe."
Deciding that you believe something is different than deciding to believe something, in my book.
"I said: "Yes, Father; I do believe in your only Son Jesus Christ". (reply)
"I decided to believe." (JS) may have been appropriate if I had actively
resisted the offer of a Grace Gift... my context was positive interest.
13 Mar 14
Originally posted by FabianFnasOriginally posted by FabianFnas
Q - By whom? A - Paul the Apostle
Okay...
Q - Of his own experience? A - yes (and documented)
Okay... by reading the bible, or...? Please clarify.
Q - Anyone who has been there and turned back? A - no, though many were kicked out as the result of a prehistoric revolt.
So there are no turning back to convince anyone?
I know that there is a New ...[text shortened]... ne that has been in heaven and taking back anything from it. Well, perhaps LSD-hallucinations...
Q - By whom? A - Paul the Apostle
Okay...
Q - Of his own experience? A - yes (and documented)
Okay... by reading the bible, or...? Please clarify. >[2 Corinthians 12:2]
Q - Anyone who has been there and turned back? A - no, though many were kicked out as the result of a prehistoric revolt.
So there are no turning back to convince anyone?
> [Christ Himself was rejected; would a human be believed or taken to an asylum?]
I know that there is a New York. I've been there, I've taken photographs, I've bought souvenirs.
I don't know anyone that has been in heaven and taking back anything from it. Well, perhaps LSD-hallucinations...
_______________________________________
"Heaven is a place, just as much a place as is New York or Chicago." Charles Ferguson Ball
"Everyone wants to know about heaven and everyone wants to go there. Recent polls suggest that nearly 80% of all Americans believe there is a place called heaven. I find that statistic encouraging because it tells me that even in this skeptical age there is something deep inside the human heart that cries out, "There's got to be something more. Something more than the pain and suffering of this life. Something more than 70 or 80 years on planet earth. Something more than being born, living, dying, and then being buried in the ground. Sometimes we talk about a "God-shaped vacuum" inside the human heart. I believe there is also a "heaven-shaped vacuum," a sense that we were made for something more than this life. We were made to live forever somewhere. In a real sense we were made for heaven.
There is another fascinating statistic I should mention. Not only do most Americans believe in heaven, most people expect to go there when they die. If you took a microphone to the streets of Chicago and asked, "Do you think you will go to heaven when you die?" the vast majority of people would answer, "I hope so," or "I think so," or perhaps "I think I've got a good chance. Not very many people would say they aren't going to heaven. Perhaps one modest point is in order. Whenever you talk about living forever somewhere, it would help to know for sure where you are going. After all, if you're wrong about heaven, you're going to be wrong for a long, long time.
With that as background, I turn now to consider some of the most frequently-asked questions about heaven. But before I jump in, I should make one preliminary point. The only things we can know for certain about heaven are the things revealed in the Bible. Everything else is just speculation and hearsay. The Bible tells us everything we need to know and I believe it also tells us everything we can know for certain about heaven."
http://www.biblestudytools.com/bible-study/topical-studies/what-is-heaven-like-11636670.html