25 Dec 11
1 edit
Originally posted by DasaOh nothing has changed, has it?
Christianity has had very little impact on spirituality - and instead has had a very great deal of impact on false beliefs.
Christianity came hundreds of years after the death of Jesus - and was not authored by Jesus.
Christianity has taken the name Jesus - and have signed it off to the fabricated writings of the Bible hundreds of years after the fact.
...[text shortened]... sus - and the rest are fabrications by mundane scholars.
This is recognized by honest people.
Thread 139039
For example, addressed to Jaywill:
Paul invented Christianity and Christians then wrote up their account in the New Testament, that inevitably conformed with and supported this religion. It may well have been based on real events, a real Jesus and his real teachings, but it is their account that we read. It is not evidence of anything other than the beliefs of the founding Christians written decades after the death of Jesus. In particular he interpreted the death of his Messiah as a blood sacrifice and on the lines of many pagan examples, as one who died, went to the underworld and returned to save us. Inspired indeed, like an imaginative act of literary criticism, but not original.
Essentially, your argument about Paul's contribution to the birth of Christianity is that he was entirely a vehicle through which God supplied everything, by divine inspiration. This leaves unfortunate consequences in its wake - as I say in another thread, He could usefully have consulted a lawyer on the wording to prevent wild speculation through misreading or ambiguous alternative readings. Indeed it would have been sensible to pick a more competent set of apostles to start with and maybe dictated some of the stuff, proof reading for important errors before approving a final draft. Sadly, Divine Inspiration is a tiresomely inefficient way to communicate, don't you agree?
However, while you are confident that you have an internally consistent set of beliefs, insulated from opposing opinions, you (like FreakyKBH) have not actually found any important defect in my reasonably consistent reading of the same history, supplemented by other authorities, consistent for example with the history of the Roman Empire and the Jews in the relevant period.
The fact that you appear to have swallowed the Bible whole and can probably quote at length for any topic under the sun (I agree you know a huge amount and I know very little by comparison) only shows that you have spent too much time reading what you agree with and not enough respecting the weight of evidence contrary to your beliefs. Which is in itself tolerable in your private life of course. Just not in public debate.
It was Thomas Aquinas who classically pointed out your error. The Bible is not useful for converting or debating with non believers. If you cannot deal with philosophy (and history) then you are not going to impress anyone.
25 Dec 11
Originally posted by wolfgang59My favourite quote from Chris and perfectly adequate. However it is even more interesting to refute with evidence.
“That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.”
10/10
Simply put but powerful!
I only wandered onto this forum to check out Hitchins and see nothing has changed in my long absence. Futility on stilts.
25 Dec 11
Originally posted by jaywillI had an uncle who was both a priest and a terrible driver. When he drove through Dublin the traffic terrified him. He did not use his mirror or signal. He just made a sign of the cross before each manoeuvre. It seemed to work for him but it was crazy being a passenger.
My better posts are preceeded and followed by prayer. Unfortunately that is not always.
25 Dec 11
Originally posted by finneganHopefully my prayer life is not that automatic, like a superstitious and mechanical ritual. Rather I seek to touch the Lord in my innermost spirit and sense His moving within me.
I had an uncle who was both a priest and a terrible driver. When he drove through Dublin the traffic terrified him. He did not use his mirror or signal. He just made a sign of the cross before each manoeuvre. It seemed to work for him but it was crazy being a passenger.
Prayer by rote or in too mechanical a way is lifeless. It is not encouraged in the Bible.
26 Dec 11
Originally posted by Proper KnobEach quote reveals a bitter and resentful mind.
Christopher Hitchen's has finally succumbed to his battle with cancer aged 62.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-16212418
A few quotes to raise a smile (hopefully).
“Faith is the surrender of the mind; it's the surrender of reason, it's the surrender of the only thing that makes us different from other mammals. It's our need to believe, and ...[text shortened]... That which can be asserted without evidence, can be dismissed without evidence.”
I hope he didn't have anything against resting in peace.
26 Dec 11
1 edit
Originally posted by usmc7257
So kinds of like the movie Alien right? I always liked that scene where the alien pops out of Sigorny Weaver's abdomen.
So kinds of like the movie Alien right? I always liked that scene where the alien pops out of Sigorny Weaver's abdomen.
No. The Alien movies were more of a Sci Fi dramatization of demon possession.
There is nothing of coercion with the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. The indwelling of God in a believer is a mingling and a blending.
"Abide in Me and I in you." is the exhortation of Christ. That mean if we abide in Him as a result He will abide in us. His actions are blent with our reactions. This is a mingling of "He who is joined to the Lord is one spirit.".
Nothing about the indwelling of Christ in a man is a matter of the usurpation of his will. Nothing about Christ living in me is a matter of Christ usurping or coercing my will.
Perhaps the illustration of power steering is more apt. In power steering the engine adds energy to the direction the steering wheel is turned by the driver. If he turns left the power steering adds power to his left turn. If he turns right the power steering adds energy to that right turn.
It is a useful illustration about the empowering of the Holy Spirit. The direction of our will is empowered by the indwelling Victor the Son of God.
This is called GRACE. This is the enjoyment of having our life blent with God, mingled with God, and incorporated with God.
So your Alien illustration is WAY off. Next time think in terms, perhaps, of power steering. Of course the indwelling Holy Spirit will not go along to impower you to be UNHOLY. In that case you are left on your own.
"As the living Father sent Me and I live because of the Father, so he who eats Me, he also shall live because of Me." (John 6:57)
