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28 Apr 18
4 edits
Prayer of the repentent X Jehovah's Witness.
"Lord Jesus, LORD Jesus Christ. I love You. I may not understand everything about You. But I both believe in You and love You.
Lord Jesus thankyou that You have become to me righteousness according to Your word. Lord Jesus, I now also thank You that I have become in You the very righteousness of God, according again, to Your word.
Lord Jesus thankyou that through faith in You I have peace towards God ... peace towards God ... wonderful peace towards God. I just thank You Lord."
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Originally posted by @thinkofone
Not sure, but you seem to believe that it is Jesus speaking in Isaiah 44:6 rather than God. This would also speculation on your part. Whatever the case you need to more explicitly make your argument.
ThinkOfOne, both Secondson and Romans1009 are exactly right.
And your problem with what the Bible tells you is not an intellectual problem. Your problem with all this is a moral one.
You do not have an intellectual problem with the statements of the Bible. You have moral problem of an unwillingness to allow God to be God.
28 Apr 18
Originally posted by @secondsonIf the Holy Spirit did not guide you to listen to Jesus Christ
You can't possibly be that dense.
The verses I provided as evidence, that you said no Christian can produce, proves that Jesus is God.
You asked for evidence, now have the courage to examine it.
instead of searching the scriptures for answers
Then the Holy Spirit is not with you.
Originally posted by @secondsonThe fact is that in Revelation 22:13 Jesus does not explicitly claim literally to be God. All you have what you read into those verses. It's pure speculation on your part.
It is a direct quote of God speaking in Isaiah, and it is a direct quote of Jesus speaking in Revelation saying the exact same thing. Both verses are a direct quote spoken by one and the same person. It's irrefutable evidence. And there are dozens and dozens more references throughout scripture that attest to the same conclusion.
On this single irrefut ...[text shortened]... ty of God does fail the doctrine promoted by both you and Rajk.
The truth will set you free.
Your conclusion that "Both verses are a direct quote spoken by one and the same person" doesn't logically follow your premise that "It is a direct quote of God speaking in Isaiah, and it is a direct quote of Jesus speaking in Revelation saying the exact same thing". It's not only pure speculation on your part, it's a non-sequitur. A cringe worthy one at that.
The bottom line is that the concept that Jesus and God are one and the same is inconsistent with the words of Jesus while He walked the Earth.
As Jesus plainly states in John 12:44-45:
"“He who believes in Me, does not believe in Me but in Him who sent Me. 45“He who sees Me sees the One who sent Me."
And in John 14:10
"“Do you not believe that I am in the Father, and the Father is in Me? The words that I say to you I do not speak on My own initiative, but the Father abiding in Me does His works."
Jesus makes a clear and explicit distinction between Him and God in the above verses and elsewhere.
Jesus is the Son. God is the Father. They are not one and the same.
The Father sent the Son. They are not one and the same.
Your argument doesn't hold up under the light of truth.
The truth will make you free.
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Originally posted by @rajk999Jesus Christ is everywhere in the Bible, not just in the New Testament and not just in the Gospels of the New Testament.
If the Holy Spirit did not guide you to listen to Jesus Christ
instead of searching the scriptures for answers
Then the Holy Spirit is not with you.
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28 Apr 18
Originally posted by @thinkofoneWhile Jesus Christ was on earth as recorded in the Gospels, He did not have the same status as God the Father OR the same status He had prior to coming to earth. The Bible is clear on that.
The fact is that in Revelation 22:13 Jesus does not explicitly claim literally to be God. All you have what you read into those verses. It's pure speculation on your part.
Your conclusion that "Both verses are a direct quote spoken by one and the same person" doesn't logically follow your premise that "It is a direct quote of God speaking in Isaiah, ...[text shortened]... me.
Your argument doesn't hold up under the light of truth.
The truth will make you free.
28 Apr 18
Originally posted by @romans1009Jesus said: .. the Holy Ghost, .. shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.
Jesus Christ is everywhere in the Bible, not just in the New Testament and not just in the Gospels of the New Testament.
Jesus condemns those who search the scriptures to find eternal life.
You search the scriptures to find eternal life, when Jesus is eternal life.
The Holy Spirit is not with you if you are not listening to Jesus
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28 Apr 18
Originally posted by @rajk999Who says I search the Scriptures to find eternal life?
Jesus said: .. the Holy Ghost, .. shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.
Jesus condemns those who search the scriptures to find eternal life.
You search the scriptures to find eternal life, when Jesus is eternal life.
The Holy Spirit is not with you if you are not listening to Jesus
Bearing false witness again? Practice what you preach, brother.
29 Apr 18
Originally posted by @sonshipDivine peace comes from Christ. Yet you quote nothing from Christ.How does divine peace come?
Can you explain further?
First divine peace comes to be through Christ's [b] justification.
Romans 8:10 says that the human spirit becomes divine life because of righteousness.
"But if Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin, the spirit is life because of ...[text shortened]... on our behalf that we might become the righteousness of God in Him." (2 Cor. 5:21)[/b]
29 Apr 18
Originally posted by @sonshipDivine peace comes from Christ. Yet you quote nothing from Christ.How does divine peace come?
Can you explain further?
Above I quoted to you that Christ becomes our righteousness - [b](1 Cor. 1:30,31). I also told you the believers become the righteousness of God !!... in Him. (2 Cor. 5:21).
Understand that we Christians have PEACE towards God because of justification out of faith.
...[text shortened]... .
But we have PEACE TOWARDS GOD ... by means of justification through faith in Jesus Christ.[/b]
You do not preach Christ. Your words discourage good works and righteousness. Instead you promote mouth worship
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29 Apr 18
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Originally posted by @rajk999
Divine peace comes from Christ. Yet you quote nothing from Christ.
You do not preach Christ. Your words discourage good works and righteousness. Instead you promote mouth worship
Divine peace comes from Christ. Yet you quote nothing from Christ.
And when Christ is a man's peace towards God, he has divine peace. That is Christ HIMSELF is our peace with God and with one another.
"For He Himself is our peace ... " (Eph. 2:14)
And the Spirit that bears witness with our spirit (Rom. 8:16) that we are children of God is our peace. For the Lord Jesus is the Spirit.
" And the Lord is the Spirit; and where the Spirit of the Lord is there is freedom." (2 Cor. 3:17)
"the last Adam became a life giving Spirit" (1 Cor. 15:45)
You are right that divine peace comes from Christ.
Peace towards God and peace towards fellow believers is the uniting bond in the Holy Spirit.
"Being diligent to keep the oneness of the Spirit in the uniting bond of peace: One Body and one Spirit, even as you were called in one hope of your calling; One Lord, one faith, one baptism;
One God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all." (Eph. 4:3-6)
One Father - Son - Holy Spirit indwelling One Body of Christ.
You do not preach Christ. Your words discourage good works
and righteousness. Instead you promote mouth worship
Your speaking lacks spiritual reality but instead manifest obsession. You're writing like an obsessed man - rather damaging psychologically.
The word which we preach is near us, in our heart and, sorry, in our mouth.
" But what does it say? The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart, that is the word of the faith which we proclaim." (Rom. 10:8)
Christ's command is through His apostles is that we believers glorify God with one MOUTH too.
"That with one accord you may with one mouth glorify the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ." (Romans 15:6)
Sorry , Lone Ranger. I thank God that He has definitely made me a churching Christian.
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Originally posted by @rajk999
Divine peace comes from Christ. Yet you quote nothing from Christ.
You do not preach Christ. Your words discourage good works and righteousness. Instead you promote mouth worship
Divine peace comes from Christ. Yet you quote nothing from Christ.
Why do you lie?
I quoted Jesus saying twice "Peace be to you" in John 20:19-22.
Bearing false witness is a breaking of one of the ten commandments.
You also boast that you are not and stay away from church Christians. But Hebrews 10 (which you love to beat disciples of Jesus with) says the Christians should not forsake our assembling together.
"And let us consider one another so as to incite one another to love and good works,
Not abandoning our own assembling together, as the custom with some is, but exhorting one another and so much the more as you see the day drawing near.
For when we sin willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth ..." (See Hebrews 10:24-26)
Your concern for love and "good works" must not really be real. And if you were a real Christian you fail to see that you should not have a "custom" of the forsaking to assemble together with other Christians.
You may pray that you assemble with a healthy group of Christians. But you boast that your CUSTOM is to go it alone.
Actually, I doubt that you are in the brotherhood of those who have received the Spirit of Christ. You don't seem eager to present yourself as such.
29 Apr 18
Originally posted by @rajk999So what you're saying is, is that not "All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:"
If the Holy Spirit did not guide you to listen to Jesus Christ
instead of searching the scriptures for answers
Then the Holy Spirit is not with you.
"instead of searching the scriptures for answers" That's what makes you a cherry picker. It's what Satan does.
Peter was well aware of your kind when he said concerning the scriptures that "... they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction."
You better be sure the spirit you have isn't the spirit of antichrist.
29 Apr 18
Originally posted by @thinkofoneJohn 12:44,45
The fact is that in Revelation 22:13 Jesus does not explicitly claim literally to be God. All you have what you read into those verses. It's pure speculation on your part.
Your conclusion that "Both verses are a direct quote spoken by one and the same person" doesn't logically follow your premise that "It is a direct quote of God speaking in Isaiah, ...[text shortened]... me.
Your argument doesn't hold up under the light of truth.
The truth will make you free.
Jesus cried and said, He that believeth on me, believeth not on me, but on him that sent me.
And he that seeth me seeth him that sent me.
If you could only understand what you're reading. Look again. Especially verse 45. Jesus is saying clearly that seeing Him is seeing God.
See me? See God. That's what Jesus is saying.
Yours isn't just a misinterpretation. Yours is a comprehension problem. You can't read.
Case in point; and this should get your attention. Look at john 5:17,18.
But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh hitherto, and I work.
Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God.
They wanted to kill Jesus for saying what they clearly understood Jesus was saying. Jesus was making Himself equal with God the Father. Equal means equal.
The Father = Jesus
Jesus = the Father
Originally posted by @secondsonOkay. I'll take them one at a time. John 5 first.
John 12:44,45
Jesus cried and said, He that believeth on me, believeth not on me, but on him that sent me.
And he that seeth me seeth him that sent me.
If you could only understand what you're reading. Look again. Especially verse 45. Jesus is saying clearly that seeing Him is seeing God.
See me? See God. That's what Jesus is saying.
Yours isn ...[text shortened]... Himself equal with God the Father. Equal means equal.
The Father = Jesus
Jesus = the Father
In the four gospels the Jews would time and again misunderstand Jesus and draw illogical conclusions based on what He was saying. In this case the reason that they concluded that He was "making Himself equal with God" was because He said that "God was His Father". This is explicitly stated in John 5:18. Today people often refer to God as their Father. Presumably you don't jump to the illogical conclusion that they are " "making [themselves] equal with God" when they do so. How is it that you are blind to what John 5:17,18 explicitly states? You have eyes but cannot see.
Here too, Jesus is the Son. God is the Father. They are not one and the same.