Originally posted by Grampy BobbyYou lack the ability to read and understand.
The Word of God in Revelation 20:15 Says [b]"Yes": Thread 157995
Unpopular as it is on this spirituality forum, I believe God's Word.[/b]
Originally posted by RJHindsThe opening post refers to eternal incineration. Where does Rev speak of that for everyone.
Yes.
And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever.... Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire.
Revelation 20:10, 15 NIV
Originally posted by divegeesterNo
Every Christian here no matter what denomination, creed, cult or otherwise, please state your position on this premise with either a yes or a no:
[b]The God whom I believe in, has created a place of eternal incineration for those who reject his offer of love and salvation.
Yes or no?[/b]
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Originally posted by Grampy BobbyGod's word also talks about the restoration do ALL things:
The Word of God in Revelation 20:15 Says [b]"Yes": Thread 157995
Unpopular as it is on this spirituality forum, I believe God's Word.[/b]
Acts 3:21
Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.
And yet you choose to believe the terrible thing?
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Originally posted by RJHindsGod's word also talks about the restoration do ALL things:
Yes.
And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever.... Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire.
Revelation 20:10, 15 NIV
Acts 3:21
Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.
And yet you choose to believe the terrible thing?
Originally posted by divegeesterActs 3:21 Refers to Christ's Second Advent and Millennial reign when Christ will establish His kingdom on earth which begins the restoration of Israel. Revelation 20:15 Refers to the Great White Throne Judgment of all who chose not to believe in the person and work of Christ at the conclusion of the Millennium. "of all things" refers to Old Testament Prophesies.
God's word also talks about the restoration do ALL things:
Acts 3:21
Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.
And yet you choose to believe the terrible thing?
"The Word of God is alive and powerful, sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of the soul and the spirit and of the joints and marrow, and is a critic of the thoughts and intents of the heart." Heb. 4:12 I believe it.
Originally posted by divegeesterI believe that the Rev passage which everyone seems to harp on must be interpreted using the rest of the teachings of Christ. Some here like to claim that they believe the Bible and scripture must interpret scripture but they follow those rules conveniently.
What do you believe?
First the Bible never says that man has an immortal soul that cannot die. The opposite is the case as Christ clearly said that God can and will destroy soul and body in hell:
Mat 10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.
The Revelation passage refers to eternal torment of the Beast, the False Prophet and Satan. Other evil people will be destroyed/killed in the lake of fire.
There are many who will not be raised and the Bible supports that as well.
Originally posted by divegeesterI'll go with what the Word says.
Every Christian here no matter what denomination, creed, cult or otherwise, please state your position on this premise with either a yes or a no:
[b]The God whom I believe in, has created a place of eternal incineration for those who reject his offer of love and salvation.
Yes or no?[/b]
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For those who believe in Jesus Christ, he has paid the price for their sin and given them the gift of life in the age to come. Those who do not believe in him will pay the penalty for sin themselves. How? By dying twice, once in this life and once and for all in the lake of fire, which is referred to as the “second death” (Rev. 20:6,14). Everlasting life is just that—life without end—and everlasting death is destruction without hope of recall—permanent extermination. This is God’s perfect justice, and it is definitely “a matter of life or death.”
John 5:28 and 29
(28) Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear His voice,
(29) And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation [judgment].
Revelation 20:15
And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
Scripture gives no hint that, when the unjust are raised from the dead for final judgment, they will be raised with new, immortal bodies as will the just. When human bodies are put into a crematorium, which is usually about 1700 degrees, they burn up. It is only a guess, but it seems likely that the “lake of fire” will be somewhat hotter than any man-made fire. Considering that one day “… the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up” (2 Peter 3:10), it seems logical that human bodies will follow suit.
In the Bible, the purpose of fire is to purge the bad from the good by burning it up.
Matthew 3:12
Whose fan is in His hand, and He will throughly purge His floor, and gather His wheat into the garner; but He will burn up [katakaio—to consume] the chaff with unquenchable fire.
This word katakaio is used in Hebrews 13:11 regarding the sacrificial beasts that were burned outside the camp. Neither chaff nor beasts burn forever. They burn up and are gone. Many verses make this clear, such as the one that follows:
Malachi 4:1
For, behold, the day cometh, that shall burn as an oven; and all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble; and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the Lord of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch.
Nowhere does the Word of God say that He will torment forever those who have refused to believe in Him. Among other things, this would be irreconcilable with Revelation 21:4, which states that from then on throughout eternity there will be no more sorrow, crying or pain.
Sidney Hatch well expresses how farfetched is the idea of a just God forever tormenting by fire those who refused to believe in Him.
A civilized society looks with horror upon the abuse and torture of children or adults. Even where capital punishment is practiced, the aim is to implement it as mercifully as possible. Are we to believe then that a holy God—our heavenly Father—is less just than the courts of men? Of course not. [7]
http://www.truthortradition.com/articles/where-are-the-dead-what-happens-if-or-when-you-die
Originally posted by Grampy BobbySin will not be and is not the basis of the Last Judgment; sin won't even be mentioned. Each unbeliever's good deeds and works will be the basis for each indictment. Reason: No matter how many good deeds and works unbelievers perform and accumulate, they all add up to human righteousness. Human righteousness cannot have relationship and fellowship with God's perfect divine righteousness. "For all of us have become like one who is unclean, and all of our righteous deeds are like a filthy garment [in the Hebrew: menstrual rags]." (Isaiah 64:6a) "He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy [grace] by the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit". (Titus 3:5) The only way to receive God's righteousness is to believe in the Lord Jesus Christ. (I Corinthians 1:30) The Last Judgment is God's time and place for the final verdict on man's futile struggle to reach heaven on his own merit. Visualize God on His Throne; all unbelievers of the human race will stand before this bench of absolute justice. No believers will be present because "there is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus." (Romans 8:1)
For what it's worth, The Word of God in Revelation 20:15 Says "Yes": Thread 157995 Unpopular as it is on this spirituality forum, I believe God's Word. This gnawing, problematic topic was previously introduced a year ago: Thread 154053
If you have believed in Christ you are spared the Last Judgment: "He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the only begotten [uniquely born] Son of God." (John 3:18) "He who believes in the Son has eternal life; but he who does not believe in the Son shall not see life but the wrath of God abides on him." (John 3:36) The unbeliever's separation from God for all eternity or second death [separation from God and destruction of the well being of body and soul] is described in Revelation 20:15: "And death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire." Since Christ paid the penalty for the sins of the entire world, God the Father's Justice cannot prosecute the human race for personal sin. The only issue is your decision regarding faith alone in Christ alone? Your call. Thread 157995