Who hardened Pharaoh's heart?

Originally posted by TheSkipper
I think it was just poor driving. Honestly people, don't slow down to answer your cell phone!! If you cannot drive normally with a phone up to your ear then don't use the phone in the car.

If I had been the driver behind you I would have angrily passed you as you slowed down and been killed by the flying vehicle...I would have died while flipping you the bird, what a way to go. 😉

TheSkipper

Lol. That certainly puts it in another perspective. Where I come from, it is illegal to drink... and er... phone and drive, so I was actually breaking the law when I bothered to answer the call in the first place.

Originally posted by Halitose
I think I missed your point. How does my surviving something prove that it wasn't God? I cannot conclusively prove that it was, yes, but it certainly doesn't infer the absence of God's intervention.

Ditto to the anthropic argument rebuttal.

My point is that many of these arguments are used to infer that not only does god exist, but that he intervenes in the matters of humans. That seemed to be the point of your post.

I don't like the whole ethos of 'wow, that was so overbearingly unlikely it must be the work of God' , if things had turned out the other way, you, nor anyone else would b praising the Lords compassion and his divine plan over the whole affair (except perhaps RBHill).

For me, it was a lucky conicidence. Don;t read too much into your brush with death.

Originally posted by no1marauder
Wouldn't that be interfering with Pharoah's free will?

Yep.

It's interesting that there is a pattern. The Pharoah had a hard heart by his own choice for a while, but then the plagues began to get to him. He softened his heart but God stepped in and hardened it. Then Pharoah grew stern again for one time, and then softened and God had to take over as the brutal, cruel abuser for the rest of the examples.

Originally posted by scottishinnz
My point is that many of these arguments are used to infer that not only does god exist, but that he intervenes in the matters of humans. That seemed to be the point of your post.

I don't like the whole ethos of 'wow, that was so overbearingly unlikely it must be the work of God' , if things had turned out the other way, you, nor anyone else wo ...[text shortened]... RBHill).

For me, it was a lucky conicidence. Don;t read too much into your brush with death.

[/b]That seemed to be the point of your post. [/b]

As you obviously missed it, let me point out that I didn't take a stance on the matter - you seem to have falsely assumed that I did; Anyway, I appreciate your thoughts on the matter.

Edit: I agree with you that the inference of God by such arguments, logically go in merry little circles.

Originally posted by no1marauder
Wouldn't that be interfering with Pharoah's free will?

Good point.

Originally posted by Halitose
That seemed to be the point of your post. [/b]

As you obviously missed it, let me point out that I didn't take a stance on the matter - you seem to have falsely assumed that I did; Anyway, I appreciate your thoughts on the matter.[/b]

Sorry if I took you out of context - I probably read a little too much into your comments.

Originally posted by scottishinnz
Sorry if I took you out of context - I probably read a little too much into your comments.

No worries, mate.

Cheers.

Originally posted by joelek
On THE WORD OF GOD thread, there has been a lot of discussion concerning an omniscient God, free will, determinism, etc. I wanted to start a new thread because that one's getting pretty large.

Let me ask a related question. When the Israelites were slaves in Egypt and God was preparing for their exodus, he sent 10 plagues on the Egyptians before Pharaoh ...[text shortened]... s -- it says Pharaoh hardened Pharaoh's heart, and it also says God hardened Pharaoh's heart.)

Who hardened Pharaoh's heart?

Satan...

Originally posted by Halitose
Something happened to me this evening which poses a similar question:

I was driving home on the freeway when a friend called me on my mobile. As I slowed the car to take the call, directly in front of me, a vehicle literally flew over the embankment from the on-coming side. It seemed like a Hollywood special-effect, complete with fiery sparks, vehicles c ...[text shortened]... he dead of night for a very trivial reason, or does God really intervene in the ways of mankind?

God rules by means of the coincidence.

Originally posted by Coletti
Good point.

Satan can reduce or even take away our free will. It depends on how much we are willing to open up to him, become his slave or servant and in this way move away from our human nature.

Originally posted by ivanhoe
Satan can reduce or even take away our fee will. It depends on how much we are willing to open up to him.

What's Satan got to do with it? The text says the "Lord hardened Pharoah's heart", the same Lord who talked to Moses. Is he Satan?

Originally posted by KnightWulfe
Honestly - it is another of the contradictions in the Bible.

All in all, it is a good story and even history book (with the typical victor's view of things) but I can see it as nothing more.

There are no contradictions. You just haven't been given the eyes to see your the ears to here and understand. Which means the spirit of truth that lives in all believers.

Originally posted by RBHILL
There are no contradictions. You just haven't been given the eyes to see your the ears to here and understand. Which means the spirit of truth that lives in all believers.

Did you get the Reese's Peanut Butter Cup rip-off shirt with the Secret Decoder Ring?

Originally posted by no1marauder
Did you get the Reese's Peanut Butter Cup rip-off shirt with the Secret Decoder Ring?

These are the shirts that I have.

http://www.redhotpawn.com/board/showthread.php?threadid=33339

So no I don't have it.

I just posted it because it was the only one that came in clear on my profile.

Originally posted by RBHILL
These are the shirts that I have.

http://www.redhotpawn.com/board/showthread.php?threadid=33339

So no I don't have it.

I just posted it because it was the only one that came in clear on my profile.

Does this look familiar?

http://www.hersheys.com/products/details/images/flavors/pf_reese_cupsstd.gif