08 Nov 07
Originally posted by Bobla45Whoooot!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NFL_playoffs,_1976-77
Tuck Rule? Huh! Thats part of the game. You should have seen the loser call they made against the Pats in the abaovementioned article that sent Stabler and those brain cancer steroid rotting weiner Raiders to the Super Bowl in the 70's....also, this morning on Mike & Mike in the morning, a very credible e ...[text shortened]... into model athletes again too! But then again, he IS the greatest coach of all time...Go Pats
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08 Nov 07
Originally posted by Bobla45Yeah I shake my head in disbelief when Raiders fans complain about the tuck rule in the 2000-2001 playoffs when in 1976-77 playoffs the Patriots got completely burned by the official Ben Dreith on the most bogus roughing the passer call of all time that sent the Raiders to the Superbowl.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NFL_playoffs,_1976-77
Tuck Rule? Huh! Thats part of the game. You should have seen the loser call they made against the Pats in the abaovementioned article that sent Stabler and those brain cancer steroid rotting weiner Raiders to the Super Bowl in the 70's....also, this morning on Mike & Mike in the morning, a very credible e ...[text shortened]... into model athletes again too! But then again, he IS the greatest coach of all time...Go Pats
08 Nov 07
Originally posted by myteamtrulystinksThere was another Team that had filed a complaint against the Patriots for that very act. I am thinking it was the Steelers(?) the year before, So I would imagine the Patriots had been under investigation. But I think a message was sent out all across the NFL, don't do it. I am thinking that it was probably just the tip of the ice berg and there is a pretty big problem through out the industry. Jerry Jones had a security guard proposition him with setting up a spying system and Jerry Jones (Dallas Cowboys) shot it down and turned the guy in. The Cowboys know that they have had people spying for quite some time. They set up an indoor closed practice facility that is off limits to everyone because of that very problem. The spying got so bad that helicopters would hover and take videos of their practice. The problem is bigger than just the Pats, and the commissioner has to start somewhere. I kid about the Pats getting caught, but there really is a problem. There is big money in spying. Think of how much money can be made with just the gambling alone, not to mention the media getting big stories to sell. Big wins mean sold out stadiums and merchandising sales go up. Several years ago no one would even buy a NE coffee cup at all, now everyone has their house filled with the junk. The teams that win bring in the big bucks. The love of money is the root of all evil.
Actually even before a memo went out everyone knows video taping the other team is cheating. It, as you pointed out is in the Unfair Acts section, of the rule book. Just like I think it is idiotic to claim that it was not cheating to use performance enhancing drugs before a sport specifically banned them (it would even more clearly fall in this s ...[text shortened]... the game is even clearer), I have no sympathy for the Patriots even if there was no prior memo.
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08 Nov 07
Originally posted by UllrABSO-EFFIN- LUTELY...you NEVER hear about that one....sounds like bias to me😵...also, this thing about the snowplow? Cheating? Its art man, this is supposed to be fun, not science. Its right up there with little Jimmy catching the ball in right to propel the Yanks over the O's, or the pine tar gig with Brett, or many other numerous quirks that happen in sports that make them great. Thats why I hate instant replay, takes the did you see the call the ump, ref blew? Just wait till next year!
Yeah I shake my head in disbelief when Raiders fans complain about the tuck rule in the 2000-2001 playoffs when in 1976-77 playoffs the Patriots got completely burned by the official Ben Dreith on the most bogus roughing the passer call of all time that sent the Raiders to the Superbowl.
08 Nov 07
Using a video tape to get signals of your opponent is and always was cheating. The fact that a commission may have warned everyone in a memo for a first violation instead of punishing them doesn't mean that the Patriots couldn't have been or shouldn't have been previously punished. You might have won a lot of games recently but it does not change this simply fact: you cheated and you got caught and once you get caught cheating once people with good reason wonder if you continue to cheat in the future or if you cheated even more in the past.
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08 Nov 07
2 edits
Originally posted by myteamtrulystinksWe simply disagree on this point. In my opinion videotaping signals prior to the 2007 season was not cheating. Goodell has made it so.
Using a video tape to get signals of your opponent is and always was cheating. And furthermore, if a future commissioner decides it is fair play then I would have no problem with that whatsoever.
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08 Nov 07
Originally posted by UllrAnd furthermore, if a future commissioner were to decide that using videotapes is allowable then I would see nothing wrong with that whatsoever. It is no worse than trying to decipher the opponents signals by other means.
We simply disagree on this point. In my opinion videotaping signals prior to the 2007 season was not cheating. Goodell has made it so.
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08 Nov 07
1 edit
Originally posted by myteamtrulystinksYes. I think using performance enhancing drugs is a far more serious offense than the videotaping incident. It is also important to note that unlike videotaping there has been an official league substance abuse and steroid policy in place for quite some time.
We do disagree. Would you argue that it was always cheating to use performance enhancing drugs or that until specific rule were in place that was not cheating?
08 Nov 07
But I was asking about before there were specific rules banning performance enhancing drugs. In sports such as baseball is was recent enough enough that some (deluded?) people think it was not cheating to use performace enhancing drugs until a specific rule was violated and therefore refuse to call violaters "cheaters". I would argue in both cases no specifc rule is necessary to be called a cheater.
08 Nov 07
Originally posted by PhlabibitMost performance enhancing drugs are illegal and certainly it is silly for a sport to make a rule that all illegally activity that gives a competitive advantage is against our rules also. However, i'd argue just just because something isn't yet illegal does not mean that taking it is fair.
Was it a legal drug?
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08 Nov 07
Originally posted by myteamtrulystinksIf there were no rule nor policy in place today regarding steroid use then it would not be cheating to use steroids provided that it is legal to do so in society as a whole. In other words if using steroids is a crime then it should be against the rules by default to use them in the NFL. Using a videocamera is not a crime and therefore is not against the rules BY DEFAULT in the NFL.
But I was asking about before there were specific rules banning performance enhancing drugs. In sports such as baseball is was recent enough enough that some (deluded?) people think it was not cheating to use performace enhancing drugs until a specific rule was violated and therefore refuse to call violaters "cheaters". I would argue in both cases no specifc rule is necessary to be called a cheater.
Another poster brought up the example of a running back pulling out a gun and shooting a linebacker. Murder or attempted murder is a crime so of course by default it is against the rules of the NFL. Not the case with videotaping.
08 Nov 07
1 edit
Originally posted by myteamtrulystinksIs drinking coffee cheating? How about Ginseng or Ginkgo Biloba?
But I was asking about before there were specific rules banning performance enhancing drugs. ...to be called a cheater.
Originally posted by jofaz
Most ...i'd argue just just because something isn't yet illegal does not mean that taking it is fair.
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08 Nov 07
Originally posted by PhlabibitNo, but if you could create a synthetic steriods or HGH type hormones with new chemical composition so as it is not what they test for it would be cheating. This isn't that far fetched; in essesence it is what BALCO was trying to do.
Is drinking coffee cheating? How about Ginseng or Ginkgo Biloba?
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