@earl-of-trumps saidSure glad the federal fascists teargassed that shooting, looting, and killing "wall of Moms" on the streets of Portland last night. The nation is surely so much safer for it.
Excellent point, Jim!!!
And nobody has the constitutional right to shoot, loot, and kill, either. Those
victims of same have constitutional rights, too, like the f'n right to live.
@soothfast saidI should think the WHOLE COUNTRY would pledge to do the same, IF....
Joe Biden should pledge to prosecute, as President, all the federal stormtroopers who are violating their oath to the Constitution by being party to extrajudicial kidnappings, illegal teargassing of protesters, excessive brutality, and wanton denial of due process.
If it proves to be the case.
Charges against the feds are flying out of everywhere. We'll see what is true and what is false.
@soothfast saidLet us try to see the light here in an unbiassed fashion, shall we, Sooth??
Sure glad the federal fascists teargassed that shooting, looting, and killing "wall of Moms" on the streets of Portland last night. The nation is surely so much safer for it.
We have two groups that are seen to be doing harm to people/property,
the Feds and the protesters. So far, so good?
The protesters:
The protesters have a right to protest, of course (right to free assembly) but,
they do not have the right to do damage to people and/or property. And when
they do same, *some level* of law enforcement has the right and duty to
step in on behalf of innocent civilians. In this case, it is the feds that have
chosen to protect federal property (in theory).
The feds:
The federal paramilitary people (what else can we call them?) were called in
to protect federal property. It is now being told that the feds themselves are
as guilty of harming innocent people as the protesters.
People have been harmed, people's rights taken away by both groups.
But all along, *certain people* in America never laid blame on the protesters,
only the Feds. Seems strange and partial to me.
Explaining: We know that 5 people in the CHOP zone in Seattle have been shot
within the zone, 2 were killed. Nobody on the left seems to be moved by this,
and I have to presume it is because everyone sees the culprits to be the
protesters. There has been widespread damage created in America by
protesters, including arsons, looting, and other mayhems, and never a person
with left tendency will ever say in anger that it is all wrongful.
How many people have the feds SHOT?
How many buildings do the feds burn down and loot?
No comparison, *if* you are objective. Remember, a life is a life and all lives
are precious, and so are their rights. They must all be protected.
The perceived wrongfulness of people having rights taken from them is ALL
political. Sorry to tell you.
The McCloskey's... Never shot anyone, never harmed anyone, never did an ounce
of harm to anyone's property, all they ever did was stand their ground.
Yet they are treated like friggin' criminals!! Pariahs.
Who shot five people in the CHOP zone, killing two??
No one knows and no one gives a BLEEP!
All politics.
@earl-of-trumps saidIt does not seem strange to me at all that "certain people" in the nation hold the protesters blameless. After all, by saying "certain people" you've cherry-picked the population to include only those who fit your charge.
People have been harmed, people's rights taken away by both groups.
But all along, *certain people* in America never laid blame on the protesters,
only the Feds. Seems strange and partial to me.
But putting that aside, there's the simple fact that the vast majority of the protesters, including the "Wall of Moms," are completely peaceful at all times. There is only that small minority that see the protests as an opportunity to cause chaos. The peaceful protesters should not be teargassed, flash-banged, shot in the head with so-called "non-lethal" projectiles, and grabbed off the street and thrown into rental vans because of the sins of a very few troublemakers.
The federal goons (there really is no better word) are not staying on federal property like they should. They've taken it upon themselves to go rogue and roam blocks away to assault and snatch people.
@earl-of-trumps saidThe violence is regrettable, though I'm not sure it's been determined whether "protesters" perpetrated it. It was known that some right-wing militia idiots were making occasional incursions into the zone to stir up crap.
Explaining: We know that 5 people in the CHOP zone in Seattle have been shot
within the zone, 2 were killed. Nobody on the left seems to be moved by this,
and I have to presume it is because everyone sees the culprits to be the
protesters. There has been widespread damage created in America by
protesters, including arsons, looting, and other mayhems, and never a person
with left tendency will ever say in anger that it is all wrongful.
Handling large-scale civil disobedience movements like Occupy Wall Street or the CHOP zone phenomenon is always a delicate balancing act between trying to maintain some sense order while at the same time not inflaming passions or violating the right to protest. Apparently you and many others here are of the opinion that a harsh crackdown is the way to go, rather than letting the crowds peter out on their own over days, weeks, or even months.
How many innocent people do you imagine would have been injured or killed had city, state, or federal law enforcement officers in full battle rattle come crashing into the CHOP zone and forcibly expelled or arrested everyone they could get ahold of? I imagine quite a lot more than 5, especially in light of the degree to which the federal crackdown in Portland has backfired. The protests are bigger than ever now.
And again, this narrative that cities are on fire or under the heel of unwashed anarchists from shore to shore is flat out fantasy. There is no evidence of this. Protesters assemble in small areas because that's just good sense: they know the area, the eyes of the world are on them so they're getting their message out, and the whole thing becomes a communal experience. Fox News, I know, is trying to make the demonstrations out to be citywide conflagrations, and perhaps you could be forgiven for thinking that's the case since they never let their television cameras roam outside the perimeter of the action. Through the lens of Fox News on a TV screen you're quite literally witnessing events with blinders on.
Fox News lies, Earl. They're tantamount to state television in a tinpot dictatorship. The sooner you and others figure that out the better off the Republic will be in the long run.
@Soothfast there's the simple fact that the vast majority of the protesters, including the "Wall of Moms," are completely peaceful at all times. There is only that small minority that see the protests as an opportunity to cause chaos.
I can agree with this. Problem!
The peaceful people stand with the marauders. How do the constabulary weed
them out? It's that simple. And I think we can agree that under the circumstances,
the police (feds or whoever) have to breakup the protesters just for that reason.
I know one thing, the peaceful ones will never give up the criminal ones. So...
@Soothfast Handling large-scale civil disobedience movements like Occupy Wall Street or the CHOP zone phenomenon is always a delicate balancing act between trying to maintain some sense order while at the same time not inflaming passions or violating the right to protest. Apparently you and many others here are of the opinion that a harsh crackdown is the way to go, rather than letting the crowds peter out on their own over days, weeks, or even months.
I do not want harsh crackdown on innocent people, of course. But I do respect
the right for law enforcement to act. Too much harm has been done already.
This is a perfect situation to remind everyone, ALL lives matter. Ok?
Now, - and I really mean this... I would not have chosen to send in troops unless
the mayor/governor asked for it. I have my reasons.