Debates
28 Aug 21
- Joined
- 18 Jan 07
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- 12477
29 Aug 21
@averagejoe1 saidBy now, torches and pitchforks are becoming a genuine option. Frankly, if I lived near Bezos, Musk, Murdoch or the Kochs - I'd be sharpening my scythe. Something is going to give, and it's not going to be the masses.
Start a thread on how they do that, i am curious. Bring it.
- Joined
- 18 Jan 07
- Moves
- 12477
29 Aug 21
@averagejoe1 saidTrue - but that's exactly why the system needs to change. Under Reagan, the Bushes, and Trump, the rich have been given all sorts of exemptions, and all the burden has been laid on the lower middle class. The aim of Biden's pledge is to restore that balance: to make the rich, and above all the ultra-rich, pay, and the common man get a break.
He will have to. The money to run this country comes not from the rich, but from the middle class, small business, etc.
Of course, naturally, libertarian and republican alike hate this. They want the little shopkeeper to pay for the magnate's sixth swimming pool, and thirtieth bedroom (for his twenty-ninth mistress). Sure, you love this imbalance, and hate Biden for remedying it. But that's been obvious since the 1980s.
@shallow-blue saidDo you hate the rich, or just jealous of them? Did they not pay the man money to build the swimming pool. Presented a job opportunity which he freely accepted? The exemptions that you speak of were legislated by 540 legislators. Never do understand your thinking there.
True - but that's exactly why the system needs to change. Under Reagan, the Bushes, and Trump, the rich have been given all sorts of exemptions, and all the burden has been laid on the lower middle class. The aim of Biden's pledge is to restore that balance: to make the rich, and above all the ultra-rich, pay, and the common man get a break.
Of course, naturally, libe ...[text shortened]... , you love this imbalance, and hate Biden for remedying it. But that's been obvious since the 1980s.
What you then say about Biden 'balancing'. Creepy stuff. YOu realize that work incentives, competition, etc, will drop off, ....you know, that pesky govt control stuff. And are you saying from each according to their ability, to each according to their needs? Creepy man. You are in Marauder's camp.
Tell us, where does the 'common man', as you and Marauder denigrate our middle class....where does he NOT get a break? A good question.
29 Aug 21
@averagejoe1 saidIts not socialist or communist or Marxist to propose taxing the rich. In fact it's conservative politicians who've proposed all these government spending programs like bailing out billionaire bankers and millionaire farmers and mailing stimulus checks without ever thinking about who is paying for it.
Do you hate the rich, or just jealous of them? Did they not pay the man money to build the swimming pool. Presented a job opportunity which he freely accepted? The exemptions that you speak of were legislated by 540 legislators. Never do understand your thinking there.
What you then say about Biden 'balancing'. Creepy stuff. YOu realize that work incentives, co ...[text shortened]... , as you and Marauder denigrate our middle class....where does he NOT get a break? A good question.
Work incentives are really really important for a functioning capitalist society. The problem with our current system is that monetary work incentives exist in full force at the top end of the income ladder, but the bottom end are not paid poverty wages. This creates a backwards system in which the entry-level employees are barely making pizza money and looking at co-workers who have been there longer but aren't making much more. They are receiving SNAP and welfare to cover the difference in living expenses that their company won't pay them. The poor are disincentivized to work because the wages are too low. Then they see the CEO who flies in on a helicopter, makes in a day what they earn in a whole year. They'll very likely never be that guy.
The proposals to tax the rich come from the fact that we need tax revenue to pay for all the ridiculous spending programs (which no politician seems to want to get rid of) and the rich have all the money.
Your idealistic society is a fairy tale. We don't live in that world.
29 Aug 21
@averagejoe1 saidHe already broke it.
He will have to. The money to run this country comes not from the rich, but from the middle class, small business, etc. Hatred of corps keep the forum pot boiling, but it is mis-directed. Money of rich folks won't be adequate. And I am doubly sure it will happen,, because I think Kamala will rise to the Presidency in a few months, and,,,,,,,hey, it was not a promise th ...[text shortened]... te it, but it is going to have to happen. We need the money to pay for Biden's very expensive plans.
&t=19s
This video makes democrats cringe. Smoke starts coming out of their ears and they cannot watch the whole thing.
29 Aug 21
@averagejoe1 saidThe rich will still be rich even if they pay every cent of the present proposed additional spending - which is $4.5 trillion over 10 years.
Given what you say is true, you appear to be saying that there is a simple answer to all this? That there is money to pay for it (which is impossible), or are you saying that there WiLL be money to pay for it when you hit up the rich? Do you and Sonhouse want to just get all the 40trillion from the rich and put them on the street? And you are naive to think it will cost ...[text shortened]... he House of Reps say it is going to cost.
You and Sonhouse are off the wall about rich people.
29 Aug 21
@wildgrass saidYou know, a working-life span is, say, 55 years. So there are hundreds of real rich people, mostly over 70. I think you are talking about people in their early 20's? Is that right? So, that means they have about 50 years to make themselves rich. If you are a liberal, I just lost you with that statement.
Its not socialist or communist or Marxist to propose taxing the rich. In fact it's conservative politicians who've proposed all these government spending programs like bailing out billionaire bankers and millionaire farmers and mailing stimulus checks without ever thinking about who is paying for it.
Work incentives are really really important for a functioning capitalis ...[text shortened]... he rich have all the money.
Your idealistic society is a fairy tale. We don't live in that world.
And, in closing, your first sentence above says to tax the rich. Correct me if I am wrong ....but are not the rich already being taxed? You want MORE from the rich? Oh. Well, how much more??
29 Aug 21
@no1marauder saidSo,,,,,,,,,,,break the rich. When president AOC needs money for the green deal thing, where will y'all go then?
The rich will still be rich even if they pay every cent of the present proposed additional spending - which is $4.5 trillion over 10 years.
That YOUTUBE just above is amazing, just watch at least the first 90 seconds. Biden extends the Trump tax reduction. Biden does. Biden is doing what you are trying to scuttle. Biden is. Your guy. Hunter's father.
A normal debater would say, as I do sometimes, because I am a normal debater................
"Man, you got me. It's not the Republicans after all. I've been listening to Suzianne too long!!"
29 Aug 21
@averagejoe1 saidWe're all being taxed not just the rich. They just happen to be taxed at a considerably lower rate than they were say 40 years ago.
You know, a working-life span is, say, 55 years. So there are hundreds of real rich people, mostly over 70. I think you are talking about people in their early 20's? Is that right? So, that means they have about 50 years to make themselves rich. If you are a liberal, I just lost you with that statement.
And, in closing, your first sentence above says to tax the ri ...[text shortened]... t are not the rich already being taxed? You want MORE from the rich? Oh. Well, how much more??
Adjusting those rates upwards can easily pay for the proposed increases in infrastructure and other spending.
29 Aug 21
@averagejoe1 saidWhat part of "the rich will still be rich" didn't you understand?
So,,,,,,,,,,,break the rich. When president AOC needs money for the green deal thing, where will y'all go then?
That YOUTUBE just above is amazing, just watch at least the first 90 seconds. Biden extends the Trump tax reduction. Biden does. Biden is doing what you are trying to scuttle. Biden is. Your guy. Hunter's father.
A normal debater would say, ...[text shortened]... "Man, you got me. It's not the Republicans after all. I've been listening to Suzianne too long!!"
29 Aug 21
@AverageJoe1
It is funny=, everyone's posts like Marauder here, which speak INDEED of a fairy tale, they say things like (it will be) $4.5 Trillion over 10 years. Like, that will be the total nut. 4.5 over 10 years. Golly, Marauder, that will be quite a stretch, like squeezing the family budget but We Can Do It!!!! But Marauder, what if another crisis hits and we have used up our credit, cannot borrow any more money, cannot tax the middle class any more, and there will no longer be rich people to tax.... What happens then?
And why won't you answer this post as it is written? Seriously ?
29 Aug 21
@no1marauder saidOK, tell us what rich is. Bernie said income should be limited to $250K a year. So what is rich to you?
What part of "the rich will still be rich" didn't you understand?
I am tired of asking you libs what 'fair share' is, never getting an answer, but maybe you will answer this one?
@no1marauder saidUpwards to what. They pay 37% now, and did you know there almost 100 different taxes? Including state taxes? But anyway, upwards to what. Don't be shy, no teaser percentages for AvJoe....you have to give the percentage that you think you need to handle Biden's programs. And send us how you arrive at the nirvana percentage.
We're all being taxed not just the rich. They just happen to be taxed at a considerably lower rate than they were say 40 years ago.
Adjusting those rates upwards can easily pay for the proposed increases in infrastructure and other spending.
Don't forget to tell us what the def of rich is.
Oh, and tell us how we will pay for the next crisis,having extended ourselves so far out, and having drained the rich.
29 Aug 21
@averagejoe1 saidIf and when another crisis hits, the US has ample resources and a AAA credit rating to deal with it.
@AverageJoe1
It is funny=, everyone's posts like Marauder here, which speak INDEED of a fairy tale, they say things like (it will be) $4.5 Trillion over 10 years. Like, that will be the total nut. 4.5 over 10 years. Golly, Marauder, that will be quite a stretch, like squeezing the family budget but We Can Do It!!!! But Marauder, what if another crisis hits and w ...[text shortened]... ax.... What happens then?
And why won't you answer this post as it is written? Seriously ?
29 Aug 21
@no1marauder saidI'm taking a nap. It useless.
If and when another crisis hits, the US has ample resources and a AAA credit rating to deal with it.
Say "I like being a lib".