Politics in America

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
I bet you weren't crying about government intervention when you were a recipient of its help Norm.

It's due Robbie, it's owed. The guvamint has said we will take this (a percentage your working life) whether you like it or not and we will give you this (die while you wait healthcare) whether you like it or not.

I really wish it were otherwise Robbie, and if you had the slightest idea of what freedom is and what that means you would also wish it too.

Do you think that after having around 1/2 of your working life taken from you a man should just wave his hands and say no thanks I'll pay for that a second or third time myself.

Originally posted by Wajoma
It's due Robbie, it's owed. The guvamint has said we will take this (a percentage your working life) whether you like it or not and we will give you this (die while you wait healthcare) whether you like it or not.

I really wish it were otherwise Robbie, and if you had the slightest idea of what freedom is and what that means you would also wish it too. ...[text shortened]... an should just wave his hands and say no thanks I'll pay for that a second or third time myself.

I have no problem with paying taxes to the government for I realize that teachers, policemen, firemen, doctors and nurses are requisite for a functioning society, if someone else can also get benefit from my taxes, then so much the better, what good is it to me anyway if as you assert i am (dying while waiting on health care)

I could never ascribe to the I'm all right jack keep your hands off my stack health care service, flip sake we came through all that nonsense after the first and second world wars.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
I have no problem with paying taxes to the government for I realize that teachers, policemen, firemen, doctors and nurses are requisite for a functioning society, if someone else can also get benefit from my taxes, then so much the better, what good is it to me anyway if as you assert i am (dying while waiting on health care)

I could never ascribe ...[text shortened]... care service, flip sake we came through all that nonsense after the first and second world wars.

The subject here is not teachers, policemen, firemen.

The subject is: Who owns your body?

Nowhere have I said you must now become an "I'm all right jack etc" type. That would require force and threats of force, and believe or not, not everyone ascribes to the belief they must force their ideals on their fellow man as you do. As already pointed out that is the measure of your reasoning, that is the measure of your ideals.

Originally posted by Wajoma
The subject here is not teachers, policemen, firemen.

The subject is: Who owns your body?

Nowhere have I said you must now become an "I'm all right jack etc" type. That would require force and threats of force, and believe or not, not everyone ascribes to the belief they must force their ideals on their fellow man as you do. As already pointed out that is the measure of your reasoning, that is the measure of your ideals.

you have failed to demonstrate a single instance of why an insistence by government to purchase health care involves an infringement of your right to claim self determination. It may involve a coercive element to purchase a specific type of policy but it hardly violates the right of self determination. We live in a society where we are not at liberty to simply do as we like for good reason and as I have pointed out there are many coercive laws which are there for our benefit, you have failed to sate a single instance of laws that are incumbent upon us that are detrimental. You belong to the I am alright jack keep your hands off my stack system as your posting history clearly advocates.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
you have failed to demonstrate a single instance of why an insistence by government to purchase health care involves an infringement of your right to claim self determination. It may involve a coercive element to purchase a specific type of policy but it hardly violates the right of self determination. We live in a society where bnot every one can ...[text shortened]... that are detrimental. You belong to the I am alright jack keep your hands off my stack system.

That has been made very clear, if I am forced to pay for X, that reduces, or completely negates my ability to pay for Y.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
you have failed to demonstrate a single instance of why an insistence by government to purchase health care involves an infringement of your right to claim self determination. It may involve a coercive element to purchase a specific type of policy but it hardly violates the right of self determination. We live in a society where we are not at liber ...[text shortened]... I am alright jack keep your hands off my stack system as your posting history clearly advocates.

Yes we know, the law of gravity right 🙄

Originally posted by Wajoma
That has been made very clear, if I am forced to pay for X, that reduces, or completely negates my ability to pay for Y.

no it doesn't, in fact it has absolutely no bearing on what you can or cannot do with your own body

Originally posted by Wajoma
That has been made very clear, if I am forced to pay for X, that reduces, or completely negates my ability to pay for Y.

Similarly, if you believe neoliberal free market ideology you are unable to think rationally or objectively - every problem has its pre-determined solution. You can't be both a pawn of the neoliberal agenda and a clear thinking citizen.

Originally posted by Wajoma
Yes we know, the law of gravity right 🙄

not a single instance of a coercive law that is detrimental

Originally posted by finnegan
Similarly, if you believe neoliberal free market ideology you are unable to think rationally or objectively - every problem has its pre-determined solution. You can't be both a pawn of the neoliberal agenda and a clear thinking citizen.

Again we see the superiority complex, this is what it comes down to, for some reason that I cannot fathom you see yourself as being more qualified at running my life than I am myself.

And then I turn around and say "you are unable to think rationally or objectively" right, but (and here's an extremely important 'but' ) I would never consider forcing my ideals on you.

You blokes that love your collectivist system are free to stick with it.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
not a single instance of a coercive law that is detrimental

Going on a waiting list because the health resources you have contributed to have been depleted by those that are reckless and careless with their health.

Originally posted by Wajoma
Going on a waiting list because the health resources you have contributed to have been depleted by those that are reckless and careless with their health.

That has no bearing on your right of self determination, you do after all still retain the right to jump from a tall building.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
That has no bearing on your right of self determination, you do after all still retain the right to jump from a tall building.

Not the law of gravity again 🙄

Alright already, we know you can't discern between fixed physical laws and laws made up by the participants in one of the least trusted proffessions in the world.

Originally posted by Wajoma
Not the law of gravity again 🙄

Alright already, we know you can't discern between fixed physical laws and laws made up by the participants in one of the least trusted proffessions in the world.

ok then, you still retain the right of self determination and can jump in front of a train.

Originally posted by Wajoma
Going on a waiting list because the health resources you have contributed to have been depleted by those that are reckless and careless with their health.

If your problem is with people who can not afford private insurance (on top of the public insurance) because of the taxes they pay, why not make the taxes a bit more progressive? That way you don't have to throw away the benefits of universal health care.