Originally posted by TheBloopNuts, the buck stops at Bush.
Bush didn't cut anything...the money went to New Orleans, tens of millions of dollars... but New Orleans officials found other, more important things on which to spend the money...like restoring Mardi Gras fountains...
The 'fault' if you want to use that term, lies 100% with the useless Mayor of New Orleans and the equally useless Governor of Louisian ...[text shortened]... ey have a problem with him NOT showing up after a disaster... just make up your minds, will ya??
Let's get things in perspective. To properly fortify the levees
of New Orleans would have been the same price as 1 or 2
cruise missiles.
Originally posted by Thequ1ck... but Bush has personal financial interests in military equipment manufacturers.
Nuts, the buck stops at Bush.
Let's get things in perspective. To properly fortify the levees
of New Orleans would have been the same price as 1 or 2
cruise missiles.
Originally posted by Thequ1ckJust to set the record straight, I'm not saying that the useless Mayor of N.O. was responsible for appropriating the money to fortify the levies.. that's Congress' job (not Bush's).
Nuts, the buck stops at Bush.
Let's get things in perspective. To properly fortify the levees
of New Orleans would have been the same price as 1 or 2
cruise missiles.
However, the money WAS appropriated...10's of millions.... but once it got to N.O., they figured "what the hell" and spent it on other things... Again, not Bush's fault...(actually, it may or may not be THIS mayor's fault, I don't know how long he's been Mayor) ... and a lot of the appropriations fuding took place in the 1990's under you-know-who's administration.
The Federal Government is NOT the first responder to a natural disaster. It is the job of the local officials to handle the evacuation of local citizens, and as you can see in New Orleans' own plan (URL provided in my prevous post) it is the Mayor's responsibility.
And, in case you didn't know, the President can not even declare a disaster area within a state...the Governor has to specifically ask the President to do so. Bush was on the phone several times with the Gov of La, in the days leading up to this hit....she kept saying she needed to think about it... again, ooooo, what leadership.
Reminds me of Hurricaine Andrew in '92.... former Gov Lawton Chiles (D-FL) took his sweet time in asking Bush "41" to declare a disaster area in Florida... and the response in the press was, "Bush (41) doesn't care about Florida". Now of course, with the internet being what it is, it's much more difficult for a Governor of one party to get away with that against a President of another party... it's getting easier to figure out who's 'fault' it was...
So, your point about the buck stopping with Bush simply because of the funding involved in fortifying the levies doesn't, if you'll pardon the pun, "hold water".
The reason the levies weren't able to withstand a Cat 4 has nothing to do with Federal funding. It has to do 100% with spending choices of the local officials when they DID get the money.
Originally posted by ivangriceTodays missiles weigh in at about $1.3million each. OK it's
How much is a cruise missile?
a far cry from the 1-2billion dollars needed to prepare for a
category 5 storm but it's only a fraction of Bush's $401 billion
defense budget.
Wanna see where the money's going?
http://www.defenselink.mil/releases/2004/nr20040202-0301.html
Originally posted by Thequ1ckHaving been to New Orleans on numerous occasions I don't see where they can prevent another flooding even if they spend 20 billion on the levees. The whole city is surrounded by water. Building the bridges on I-10 into the city took years to build. The pilings are almost 300 feet in the ground. They had to go that deep just to finally hit solid rock. You can't dig more than a foot in the city till you hit the water table.
Todays missiles weigh in at about $1.3million each. OK it's
a far cry from the 1-2billion dollars needed to prepare for a
category 5 storm but it's only a fraction of Bush's $401 billion
defense budget.
Wanna see where the money's going?
http://www.defenselink.mil/releases/2004/nr20040202-0301.html
from aerial photos in newsweek it looks like all the breaks were on canals running through the city, not on lakefront levees. they could have tried putting floodgates at the canal mouths, and closing them and maybe pumping out the canals when the hurricane looked like it would make landfall there.
Originally posted by Thequ1ckNo.
Nuts, the buck stops at Bush.
Let's get things in perspective. To properly fortify the levees
of New Orleans would have been the same price as 1 or 2
cruise missiles.
The levees that broke were fixed. They were part of a project started in 1965, to be finished in 10 years. So the system was 30 years overdue. The ones that broke were done already.
For a cat-3 storm.
Bush did not make this a cat 5 storm.
And the plan to upgrade them, helped in part by the Dem. Governer of LA... was slated to begin in 06.
Next
Year.
😉
People, it is _not_ Bush's fault that the levees broke.
Bush's fault that the national guard wasn't federalized sooner?
No.
That is the fault of the Dem gov. of LA -- for not asking Bush to take control of the _state_ National Guard faster.
The "ball dropping" on this issue is -bipartisain- all around. _EVERYONE_ dropped their balls and reverted to a "someone else will do it" state of virtual "fetal position".
Sadly.
Originally posted by TheBloopThe Gov. of LA declared a state of emergency on AUG. 26th. Two days prior to the storm making landfall. It is my understanding that the moment she did that it became 'federalised'.
Just to set the record straight, I'm not saying that the useless Mayor of N.O. was responsible for appropriating the money to fortify the levies.. that's Congress' job (not Bush's).
However, the money WAS appropriated...10's of millions.... but once it got to N.O., they figured "what the hell" and spent it on other things... Again, not Bush's fa ...[text shortened]... ing. It has to do 100% with spending choices of the local officials when they DID get the money.
TheSkipper
Here is a bit of information regarding the funding of levees from a journal called "Editor & Publisher".
the link: http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1001051313
And here is a portion of the article itself:
New Orleans had long known it was highly vulnerable to flooding and a direct hit from a hurricane. In fact, the federal government has been working with state and local officials in the region since the late 1960s on major hurricane and flood relief efforts. When flooding from a massive rainstorm in May 1995 killed six people, Congress authorized the Southeast Louisiana Urban Flood Control Project, or SELA.
Over the next 10 years, the Army Corps of Engineers, tasked with carrying out SELA, spent $430 million on shoring up levees and building pumping stations, with $50 million in local aid. But at least $250 million in crucial projects remained, even as hurricane activity in the Atlantic Basin increased dramatically and the levees surrounding New Orleans continued to subside.
Yet after 2003, the flow of federal dollars toward SELA dropped to a trickle. The Corps never tried to hide the fact that the spending pressures of the war in Iraq, as well as homeland security -- coming at the same time as federal tax cuts -- was the reason for the strain. At least nine articles in the Times-Picayune from 2004 and 2005 specifically cite the cost of Iraq as a reason for the lack of hurricane- and flood-control dollars.
Newhouse News Service, in an article posted late Tuesday night at The Times-Picayune Web site, reported: "No one can say they didn't see it coming. ... Now in the wake of one of the worst storms ever, serious questions are being asked about the lack of preparation."
In early 2004, as the cost of the conflict in Iraq soared, President Bush proposed spending less than 20 percent of what the Corps said was needed for Lake Pontchartrain, according to a Feb. 16, 2004, article, in New Orleans CityBusiness.
<end quote>
Sounds pretty damning, eh?
TheSkipper
Originally posted by slimjimYou should be asking Shavixmir this one.
Having been to New Orleans on numerous occasions I don't see where they can prevent another flooding even if they spend 20 billion on the levees. The whole city is surrounded by water. Building the bridges on I-10 into the city took years to build. The pilings are almost 300 feet in the ground. They had to go that deep just to finally hit solid rock. You can't dig more than a foot in the city till you hit the water table.
Those dutchies know how to make a sandcastle waterproof.
Originally posted by MorrenSmacks of SVW - whatever happened to him?
No.
The levees that broke were fixed. They were part of a project started in 1965, to be finished in 10 years. So the system was 30 years overdue. The ones that broke were done already.
For a cat-3 storm.
Bush did not make this a cat 5 storm.
And the plan to upgrade them, helped in part by the Dem. Governer of LA... was slated to begin in 06. ...[text shortened]... lls and reverted to a "someone else will do it" state of virtual "fetal position".
Sadly.