19 May 20
@earl-of-trumps saidWho has said he can’t take it? Libs believe quite rightly you can do what you like with your own body.
I think most libs - if not all libs, believe that a woman has the right to an abortion because it is her body, which she has the sole right to determine what to do with.
But note, the same libs in here freekin' the bleep out at Trump's taking the drug. Hey libs, what happened to "it's his body"?? "HATE TRUMP" - at all costs, "HATE TRUMP"!
You frauds, you phonies.
But we’re still allowed to notice ‘stupid’ when it jumps out of the bushes and dances naked in front of us, and that’s exactly the kind of stupid that you want to have in the White House for another four years.
19 May 20
1 edit
@vivify saidI can't read your mind, but can I suggest that perhaps your assessment is clouded by a hatred of Trump? Approved specifically or not, doctors are free to prescribe drugs for "off-label" purposes. "Off-label" use of drugs is not new. And HC has been around a while, so the potential side effects for short term and long term use ought to be well understood.
It's still not yet approved for COVID. But Trump said he's taking the drug to *prevent* infection; in your link 66 percent of doctors said they currently wouldn't do that.
Here are two things that can't both be true:
1. Trump is an idiot for taking HC.
2. 30% of doctors would give to their own family members who may have been exposed, even if there is no positive test.
I know there are many consumers of sensationalized news that want more stories telling them how much smarter than Trump they are, but if 65% of doctors surveyed would use this drug for treating COVID, you must realize that you are engaged in hair-splitting when you try to reconcile that while still saying Trump is stupid for using the drug.
It may turn out that HC is less effective than we hope. But the decision on whether to take the drug or is an exercise in risk-management in light if imperfect data, EXACTLY like any other prescription drug use.
Trump has plenty of flaws you can criticize. Why not focus on real reasons? You damage your credibility when you buy into these silly media narratives.
And, no, a mechanical engineer did not kill himself taking fish-tank (a different substance) because of a Trump expressed optimism for HC. That's a silly narrative being spoon fed by the media also.
19 May 20
@lemondrop removed their quoted postAt least I didn't believe the lie that a mechanical engineer took a large dose of fish tank cleaner because Trump expressed optimism that a different substance could be a good treatment for Covid.
19 May 20
@Earl-of-Trumps
So to hate Trump is FRAUD? What dictionary did you get THAT from? If we say we hate tRUMP, we fukking hate tRUMP. No fraud, no hypocrites here. YOU are the one blinded by a con man, hypnotized by his supposed super powers in business.
Too bad you can't see through his lies and deceptions.
19 May 20
3 edits
@techsouth saidThe survey in your link had 70 percent (I said 66 before) of doctors saying they would not prescribe it to someone in the way Trump is. 70 percent. Why am I still wrong for siding the majority of doctors in a survey you provided?
I can't read your mind, but can I suggest that perhaps your assessment is clouded by a hatred of Trump? Approved specifically or not, doctors are free to prescribe drugs for "off-label" purposes. "Off-label" use of drugs is not new. And HC has been around a while, so the potential side effects for short term and long term use ought to be well understood.
Here are two ...[text shortened]... would give to their own family members who may have been exposed, even if there is no positive test.
But I get your point, and I'll answer the meat of what you're saying. You're saying that those who oppose Trump are attacking a drug that could potentially be beneficial in the fight against COVID, for no other reason than Trumping promoting it. Right?
The problem, as always, is with Trump jumping the gun and rushing to judgement on issues that need to be carefully considered. He did the same with the coronavirus, dismissing it as something that will "disappear". We're now at 91,000 deaths in five months from the coronavirus.
You said a man didn't die from taking hydroxychloroquine; every major news outlet from ABC, NBC and Forbes are all reporting this as fact. So outside of some report from a credible source refuting their claims, I have no reason to believe it's not fact. That said, the man died because Trump said "What are you waiting for? Go take it." It's irresponsible actions like this that are the problem.
If Trump would've simply said there's a drug being tested that shows promise and hopes it can be used, that would've been fine. But Trump's lack of carefully weighing the issue lead to yet another irresponsible act (ultimately resulting in someone's needless death). Again: it's not just on this issue, but it's with *everything* Trump does in his president, usually with detrimental results, like referring to the COVID situation as a "hoax".
If hydroxychloroquine turns out to be a useful drug in treating or even prevent COVID, I'm all for it. But it still wouldn't change the irresponsible way he's been touting it, which is in line with how he handles everything.
19 May 20
@vivify saidHatred of Trump is so widespread that those in that camp don't fully realize how much their opinions only stand muster in the safe environment of other Trump Haters. As one example, the accusation that Trump called CV a "hoax". That didn't happen. See this link: https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-coronavirus-rally-remark/ . They somehow rule it a "mixture", even though their own assessment is that he did not call it a hoax. You don't seem to realize how much you're being lied to.
The survey in your link had 70 percent (I said 66 before) of doctors saying they would not prescribe it to someone in the way Trump is. 70 percent. Why am I still wrong for siding the majority of doctors in a survey you provided?
But I get your point, and I'll answer the meat of what you're saying. You're saying that those who oppose Trump are attacking a drug that cou ...[text shortened]... n't change the irresponsible way he's been touting it, which is line with how he handles everything.
As far as siding with the majority, even if only 30% of the doctors would use HC the way Trump is, that's enough to put his behavior in the "ok" category. Trump would be monitored for ill side affects far more carefully than you or I. Also, 70% of doctors that said "no", have been shaped by years of liability avoidance. The fact that only 41 out of 50 states have "right to try" legislation should be all anyone needs to see to understand that the US system, due probably to high litigation, is not the best it could be at good risk-management decisions. You are free to opine that using HC preventatively for someone possibly exposed is the wrong choice. If you are a doctor who absolutely don't want to be sued and that's all that matters, then HC is the wrong choice for you as a doctor. I'm challenging anyone who says it is a unqualified stupid choice.
But you could convince me I'm wrong. Just show me the numbers you've crunched and let me check them. Risk of side affects for taking HC versus risk of consequences for not taking a drug that may work. This would also need to take into account frequency of monitoring which could help avoid severe consequences if monitoring is very frequent. Obviously you don't know the exact dose Trump is taking, so you'll have to make a fair guess.
Lots of people dismissed CV early as not something that will be a big deal. Some tend to be more optimistic. But here we set, racking up over 1000 deaths per day WHILE practicing extreme social distancing. Even at this late date we have no good choices that can make that magically go away (but somehow Trump haters unanimously agree there were obvious magical choices back then). Trump closed the border with China when almost all the media accused him of being motivated solely by racism. Perhaps we could have gotten ahead of things had the government took extreme measures. But if you're honest, you'll have to admit that Trump would have been accused of being a dictator and they probably would have drawn up more impeachment articles if he'd done anything more extreme. In any case almost ANYTHING that is good to do can always be looked back upon with 20/20 vision and deemed to be something that would have been better if done sooner. NO ONE who first heard of CV reacted instantly in an extreme way.
And I'll add, regardless of who reported it. If you heard that a mechanical engineer took fish tank cleaner because Trump suggested HC might be good for CV, you should develop your BS detector a little more. You're being lied to.
@techsouth saidThe only problem with the Trumpster is himself!
Hatred of Trump is so widespread that those in that camp don't fully realize how much their opinions only stand muster in the safe environment of other Trump Haters. As one example, the accusation that Trump called CV a "hoax". That didn't happen. See this link: https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-coronavirus-rally-remark/ . They somehow rule it a "mixture", even t ...[text shortened]... d HC might be good for CV, you should develop your BS detector a little more. You're being lied to.
If he could only learn to tell the truth, and quit firing people much smarter than he is but we know that isn't going to happen don't we.
-VR
19 May 20
@techsouth
"
Lots of people dismissed CV early as not something that will be a big deal. Some tend to be more optimistic. But here we set, racking up over 1000 deaths per day WHILE practicing extreme social distancing. Even at this late date we have no good choices that can make that magically go away (but somehow Trump haters unanimously agree there were obvious magical choices back then). Trump closed the border with China when almost all the media accused him of being motivated solely by racism. Perhaps we could have gotten ahead of things had the government took extreme measures. But if you're honest, you'll have to admit that Trump would have been accused of being a dictator and they probably would have drawn up more impeachment articles if he'd done anything more extreme. In any case almost ANYTHING that is good to do can always be looked back upon with 20/20 vision and deemed to be something that would have been better if done sooner. NO ONE who first heard of CV reacted instantly in an extreme way.
These are your words. There are MANY more reasons to hate tRUMP.
His OBVIOUS corruption, his firing of 4 IG"s who are there to be independent investigators as another check and balance of the WH, set in place 40 years ago as a result of the Nixon years. Now we have another would be dictator who thinks he is above the law and you I think know that quite well.
The firing of the last IG was a direct result of Pompeo asking Trump to fire him since he was investigating Pompeo himself.
Can't have THAT can we? This is CLEAR corruption on the highest levels and if you can't see that you are blind. That is only ONE thing we talk about in the corruption of Trump. There are many more but I don't want to write a whole book on the subject, way better writers than me have already done that, like 'Everything Trump touches, DIES;. Great book. and MANY MORE.
But of course you would never read any of those would you, better to keep you in the dark about what Trump is doing to ruin the US, and our reputation around the world which is now in the toilet, the US is a laughing stock now.
19 May 20
@very-rusty saidWell, if critics were savvy enough to stop repeating lies, perhaps I would be more easily persuaded when they offer criticism that is not an obvious fake narrative.
The only problem with the Trumpster is himself!
If he could only learn to tell the truth, and quit firing people much smarter than he is but we know that isn't going to happen don't we.
-VR
Those that claim they believe a mechanical engineer took fish tank cleaner because of Trump diminish their credibility to the point that I personally don't even listen to the rest of their scholarly critique of the president.
Trump has many flaws, like other politicians. I observe some of them myself. But organizations such as CNN and those that believe CNN is even slightly objective have lost their ability to persuade me of anything.
19 May 20
@sonhouse said@sonhouse
@techsouth
"
Lots of people dismissed CV early as not something that will be a big deal. Some tend to be more optimistic. But here we set, racking up over 1000 deaths per day WHILE practicing extreme social distancing. Even at this late date we have no good choices that can make that magically go away (but somehow Trump haters unanimously agree there were obvious magical c ...[text shortened]... US, and our reputation around the world which is now in the toilet, the US is a laughing stock now.
These are your words. There are MANY more reasons to hate tRUMP.
If there are so many reasons to hate Trump, why are the most passionate Trump haters repeating lies? If you want to persuade me, there are more tactful approaches. And it would have to start with an acknowledgement that the likes of CNN routinely lie to disparage the president. There is a lot going on the the world, and a lot of things go on behind the scenes that I'll never be privy to. I'm old enough to understand that the media can construct narratives to make innocent actions seem evil.
Perhaps you follow more closely than me, and if I sat at your feet long enough you'd win me over. But if you can't see that the media is lying about Trump too, then sorry, you don't have enough credibility with me as an objective person that I'm going to be listening very long.
19 May 20
4 edits
@techsouth saidTrust me, I've been aware the context Trump used it in, which is why I said "the situation around" it, rather than the virus itself. In that context, Trump has been pushing that the virus isn't as serious as his opponents make it out to be. In fact, his son Eric was recently on Fox News saying the virus will go away after the election and will no longer be an issue, implying the seriousness of it is simply a media-driven lie:
Hatred of Trump is so widespread that those in that camp don't fully realize how much their opinions only stand muster in the safe environment of other Trump Haters. As one example, the accusation that Trump called CV a "hoax". That didn't happen. See this link: https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-coronavirus-rally-remark/ . They somehow rule it a "mixture", even t ...[text shortened]... essment is that he did not call it a hoax. You don't seem to realize how much you're being lied to.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2020/05/17Th/eric-trump-coronavirus/
In fact, Fox News pushed an anti-coronavirus conspiracy that lead to actual coronavirus deniers:
https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/social-media/coronavirus-deniers-take-aim-hospitals-pandemic-grows-n1172336
The deniers aren't claiming the virus isn't real, but that the situation has been overblown.
Also, 70% of doctors that said "no", have been shaped by years of liability avoidance.
So what are you saying? That doctors from your own source who don't support your argument (which are the clear majority) aren't thinking objectively? With all due respect, aren't you now the one letting bias cloud your thinking?
Again, if the drug ends up being useful for fighting the virus, I'm all for it and I don't even mind giving Trump credit for it. The problem, as I mentioned before, is his way of going about it is detrimental. Trump wants to reopen businesses and is willing to prematurely cite possible treatments in order to so. Trump isn't letting rationality guide him he's being driven by capitalist greed. Trump doesn't care about a COVID treatment, he cares about making his rich friends money again. That's why Trump isn't waiting for proper testing to make a decision. Hence Trump's words: "What are you waiting for? Take it!"