27 Feb 05
Originally posted by ivanhoeNo, and I'm not willing to sacrifice my three year old grandson for your fanatical religious beliefs either. The nation of Israel seems quite capable of defending itself without the US attacking a bunch of Muslim countries to protect your imaginary Old Testament monster God's fictitious "Special Covenant" with Israel. Israelis are doing a lot more killing than being killed right now anyway and their "existence" doesn't seem terribly threatened. How does it feel to be a warmonger, yet call yourself "Pro-Life", Ivanhoe?
All right then, brave man.
Are you willing to fight and eventually kill in order to defend the Jewish people from being attacked and threatened in their present existence ?
27 Feb 05
1 edit
Originally posted by no1marauderYou didn't answer my question. I said if the Jewish people were seriously threatened in their existence ... answer the question No1 and don't twist the question into something else that isn't the question.
No, and I'm not willing to sacrifice my three year old grandson for your fanatical religious beliefs either. The nation of Israel seems quite capable of defending itself without the US attacking a bunch of Muslim countries to pr ...[text shortened]... t feel to be a warmonger, yet call yourself "Pro-Life", Ivanhoe?
27 Feb 05
Originally posted by ivanhoeNo you didn't. Your exact question was:
You didn't answer my question. I said if the Jewish people were seriously threatened in their existence ... answer the question No1 and don't twist the question into something else that isn't the question.
Are you willing to fight and eventually kill in order to defend the Jewish people from being attacked and threatened in their present existence?
If they ever have the very existence of the Jewish people threatened, yes. If all you mean is Jewish control of the nation that is now called Israel, no. Answer your question?
27 Feb 05
Originally posted by no1marauder
No you didn't. Your exact question was:
Are you willing to fight and eventually kill in order to defend the Jewish people from being attacked and threatened in their present existence?
If they ever have the very existence of the Jewish people threatened, yes. If all you mean is Jewish control of the nation that is now called Israel, no. Answer your question?
But why, pray tell, No1 are you making such a fuss about my stance, which is essentiallly the same ?
27 Feb 05
Originally posted by ivanhoeBecause you seem to believe that the very existence of the Jewish people is threatened by political events in the Middle East and your preferred solutions are actions that will inevitably lead to large-scale bloody war. The Iran situation is typical; rather than Iran being "allowed" to have a nuclear weapon, you would support war against them even though Israel already possesses hundreds of nuclear weapons and is quite able to defend itself. You already support the war that is being waged against the people of Iraq by the US and other countries and interference with the wishes of the Lebanese government in order to pressure Syria. So how many Muslim countries do you believe should be attacked to protect Israel?
But why, pray tell, No1 are you making such a fuss about my stance, which is essentiallly the same ?
28 Feb 05
Originally posted by no1marauderNo1: "..... and your preferred solutions are actions that will inevitably lead to large-scale bloody war."
Because you seem to believe that the very existence of the Jewish people is threatened by political events in the Middle East and your preferred solutions are actions that will inevitably lead to large-scale bloody war. The Iran situation is typical; rather than Iran being "allowed" to have a nuclear weapon, you would support war against them ...[text shortened]... ressure Syria. So how many Muslim countries do you believe should be attacked to protect Israel?
..... your thinking only implies the worst case scenarios, wherein you are also willing to support the Jewish people, the State of Israel, if it is threatened in its very existence.
I support policies that will prevent this situation ever coming into existence.
No1: "The Iran situation is typical; rather than Iran being "allowed" to have a nuclear weapon, you would support war against them ... "
Allowing Iran to have a nuclear weapon is a serious security threat to Israel, to the region and as a result of that to the world. Iran has stated that it would like to wipe Israel from the face of the earth.
Israel never stated it wants to wipe Iran from the face of the earth ....
No1, your "it is not fair" attitude, inspired by I assume honest and genuine moral indignation, leads to risky attitudes and very risky policies regarding world peace. We should opt for and strongly support the non-proliferation of nuclear weapons, including the question of the destruction of Israels nuclear weapons, which question needs to be adressed and settled in a general peace agreement between Israel and ALL the countries hostile to it, garanteed by the Super and Giga powers.
A peace agreement between Israel and the Palestinians will not entail Israels destruction of nuclear arms as you and the Palestinians undoubtedly will understand.
Again in the case of Iran you're only looking at the worst case scenario. What I hope for is that the European Three will succeed in getting Iran to accept a negotiated deal. However I'm not inclined to believe in any succesfull result looking at Iran's firm and resolute stance, the weak position of the European Three, also known as the Toothless Three, and the very unfortunate and undesirable Russian policies in this regard that seem to undermine every European effort.
We all know the stick and carrot approach in international politics. Well, in my view, Europe is emphasising the carrot approach too much and the US is inclined to emphasise the stick approach too much. If Europe and the United States, and if possible Russia and China, would be able to reach an agreement about how to tackle this problem in a balanced stick and carrot approach the problem would be solved within a reasonable amount of time. However, I would be more than happy to see the Atlantic partners proceed together in a joint effort to persuade Iran not to enrich uranium and not to develop other necessary programs for building nuclear weapons. But I'm afraid this will also and again, not be the case.
28 Feb 05
Originally posted by ivanhoeI wish to respond to this post, but I am about to eat. As we are getting into a substantive discussion of the Middle East situation, might I suggest that you start another thread and either copy your last post (which raised several valid points) and use it has a first post or write another? I'm afraid that others who might wish to give opinions regarding the Middle East will not want to look at this thread because of the title. I wish to discuss these points further and will be back on within the hour.
No1: "..... and your preferred solutions are actions that will inevitably lead to large-scale bloody war."
..... your thinking only implies the worst case scenarios, wherein you are also willing to support the Jewish people, the State of Israel, if it is threatened in its very existence.
I support policies that will prevent this situation ever coming ...[text shortened]... ams for building nuclear weapons. But I'm afraid this will also and again, not be the case.
28 Feb 05
Originally posted by no1marauder
I wish to respond to this post, but I am about to eat. As we are getting into a substantive discussion of the Middle East situation, might I suggest that you start another thread and either copy your last post (which raised several valid points) and use it has a first post or write another? I'm afraid that others who might wish to give opinions ...[text shortened]... ecause of the title. I wish to discuss these points further and will be back on within the hour.
See the "Situation in the Middle East" thread.
28 Feb 05
Originally posted by ivanhoeI didn't know you don't read his posts. Why don't you?
Ah Captain Kirk. ALWAYS willing to support the crowd, NEVER the loner.
By the way what hypocrisy are you referring too ? As everyone knows I do not read Darfius's posts. I reacted to the pressure being put on Darfius by No1 and Nemesio to answer a trick question.
01 Mar 05
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Originally posted by AThousandYoungWhy should I ? He sends me to hell for not having the true religion ..... 😀
I didn't know you don't read his posts. Why don't you?
I don't understand why people are complaining so vehemently ....... relax, have a nice cup of coffee and read the threads you're interested in .... chill out ... 🙄 😛