robbie carrobie

Originally posted by FMF
You admit that "nothing they actually said showed up for anyone to read or hear" and yet you have chosen to project a most deliberate form of malevolence onto their motives?

The facts pretty much speak for themselves.

Originally posted by lemon lime
The facts pretty much speak for themselves.

So you seem to think. I suppose we all do it from time to time. In my case, I can sometimes be inclined to poison the well ~ to superimpose the most damning interpretation of someone's motives ~ when talking about paedophiles or murderers or rapists. I, however, don't have 'lesbians pushing back against discrimination' on that list. That's why I found your claim interesting although I am not surprised that you have no statement of any kind by the couple to substantiate your interpretation.

Originally posted by FMF
So you seem to think. I suppose we all do it from time to time. In my case, I can sometimes be inclined to poison the well ~ to superimpose the most damning interpretation of someone's motives ~ when talking about paedophiles or murderers or rapists. I, however, don't have 'lesbians pushing back against discrimination' on that list. That's why I found your claim ...[text shortened]... prised that you have no statement of any kind by the couple to substantiate your interpretation.

That was somewhat clever of you, but again there was no statement from that couple for me to provide.

If you can stop projecting your own thoughts into this then maybe there could be some basis for discussion. As it is you seem to be more interested in painting villianous mustaches onto people you don't agree with than you are in giving any kind of rational response.

Originally posted by lemon lime
The facts pretty much speak for themselves.

lemon lime: Less than a year ago in my area a lesbian couple were planning on getting married, so they went to a Christian bakery to have a wedding cake made for them. The Christian bakery said no, so the couple went to the local news outlets to tell their sad story and threatened to sue the bakery. It wasn't long before the bakery was forced to shut down because of all the news reports... few people were willing to be seen going into their establishment.

Here's an interpretation of the "facts": 'Its customers boycotted the bakery to express their sympathy with the lesbian couple after seeing all the news reports, and having alienated those who kept it going, the business was forced to shut down.'

The facts pretty much speak for themselves?

Originally posted by lemon lime
If you can stop projecting your own thoughts into this then maybe there could be some basis for discussion. As it is you seem to be more interested in painting villianous mustaches onto people you don't agree with than you are in giving any kind of rational response.

But isn't the fact we are BOTH sharing our thoughts on this story the basis for our discussion? I rather think it is you who has painted moustaches on the lesbians and I have been clear about why I think so. Who is it you think I am painting a moustache on? I have already stated that I have some 'ideological' sympathy for the bakery.

Originally posted by Suzianne
I don't have enough thumbs to give this post the recognition it deserves.

Glad someone sees past the concocted BS to the real posting habits, and therefore the lack of integrity, beneath the surface, beyond what he wants people to see. Misdirection, yes, he excels, unfortunately.

Actually, I thought you were speaking to FMF specifically, since I find ...[text shortened]... the same tactic because of the (apparent) success of it. As you said, it's the same technique.

I appreciate that. You've been here longer than I have and I'm probably slower to catching on than most people. But this is all finally starting to become supremely boring for me too, and I don't know how much longer I can listen to this guy go on and on about nothing but him, and what he thinks and what is important to him and blah blah blah blah... It's all about him... pffft.

Originally posted by FMF
But isn't the fact we are BOTH sharing our thoughts on this story the basis for our discussion? I rather think it is you who has painted moustaches on the lesbians and I have been clear about why I think so. Who is it you think I am painting a moustache on? I have already stated that I have some 'ideological' sympathy for the bakery.

I have some 'ideological' sympathy for you as well.

Originally posted by lemon lime
...I don't know how much longer I can listen to this guy go on and on about nothing but him, and what he thinks and what is important to him and blah blah blah blah... It's [b]all about him... pffft.[/b]

If I'm not supposed to express my opinions and perspectives ~ in response to your opinions and perspectives, as you have expressed them ~ then whose opinions and perspectives am I supposed to express in a discussion? 🙂

Originally posted by FMF
If I'm not supposed to express my opinions and perspectives ~ in response to your opinions and perspectives, as you have expressed them ~ then whose opinions and perspectives am I supposed to express in a discussion? 🙂

Looks like you're caught in a paradox, doesn't it.

Actually it does appear you are expressing opinions you've heard from other people, and not so much your own opinions. Some of your posts read like those opinions came from a propaganda leaflet. I have to wonder just how much of what you're saying is really just you parroting what you think you should be saying.

How much of what you say actually comes from you reflecting on things, and then genuinely coming up with your own ideas? Your responses appear to be mostly reflexive... if it's not supposed to be okay to criticize gays and lesbians then your response mechanism immediately kicks in to argue against that criticism. Are you fearful of what people might think of you if your views are not in line with popular opinion?

Originally posted by lemon lime
...if it's not supposed to be okay to criticize gays and lesbians then your response mechanism immediately kicks in to argue against that criticism. Are you fearful of what people might think of you if your views are not in line with popular opinion?

I think it's OK to criticize gays and lesbians. I think it's OK to criticize bakeries that discriminate against customers. I think it's OK to criticize the notion that a private business should be forced to enter into transactions with people it does not want to. If that's "in line with popular opinion" in the U.S. then so be it.

Furthermore, I think it's OK for you to criticize me for how you perceive me to have arrived at my opinions. I also think it's OK for me to try to engage a poster in discussion if I sense he has tried to attribute the most cynical of motives to people whose actions he disapproves of.

The way you framed the lesbians' reaction ~ to what they saw as prejudice and discrimination ~ was very interesting to me. I don't really see the connection between "popular opinion" as you see it, and my opinion. I am not "fearful of what people might think of [me and my views]". I don't think my posting style here over the last however-many-years-it-has -been has ever been "fearful".

Originally posted by lemon lime
That was somewhat clever of you, but again there was no statement from that couple for me to provide.

If you can stop projecting your own thoughts into this then maybe there could be some basis for discussion. As it is you seem to be more interested in painting villianous mustaches onto people you don't agree with than you are in giving any kind of rational response.

As it is you seem to be more interested in painting villianous mustaches onto people you don't agree with than you are in giving any kind of rational response.

Man thats brilliants its going on Robbies profile hall of fame! Villianous mustaches seem to be trendy at present.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
As it is you seem to be more interested in painting villianous mustaches onto people you don't agree with than you are in giving any kind of rational response.

Man thats brilliants its going on Robbies profile hall of fame! Villianous mustaches seem to be trendy at present.

bummer just shaved mine off.

Originally posted by Suzianne
My entire point was that being straight in a "gay world", one would find immeasurably less intolerance and bias than a gay person does in this "straight world".

Of course it's always been around. There's just a little less intolerance being shown about it these days than in the past. Years gone by, you'd be plain stupid to admit being gay for fe ...[text shortened]... ft but a bony torso. Thank God there's less intolerance to it these days. It took long enough.

I fully agree and would like to add a parallel of being white in a black world is much easier than being black in a white world.

Originally posted by Suzianne
MOTS. Yes, more of the same.

Attack the person, not the argument. Same old, same old.

Speaking of argumentum ad hominem, if you refrained from attacking the person every time you post
and relied on fair argument and honest discussion of the issues.. you'd be speechless.

Originally posted by HandyAndy
Speaking of argumentum ad hominem, if you refrained from attacking the person every time you post
and relied on fair argument and honest discussion of the issues.. you'd be speechless.

Ride on brutha Andy, tell it like it is!, give us a twirl of those villainous whiskers 😀