18 Feb 08
Originally posted by gambit05I have given up totally on black but it is worth considering just what exactly are blacks options as there are so few to look at.
It seems that I am the only one left who hasn't surrendered black. Not that I like black position, but I still think that it is not that easy for white. Black will likely play Bg7 in the next move, and with that he slowly starts to develop, still retains his Queen as his major defending piece, and for potential sacrifices.
Please give me the winning lines for white if you know them.
15. ... Qe3+, 16. Kh1 .. Qe6, 17. Qg5+ (Raf1 might even be better) .. Qg6, 18. Rf8+ .. Kf8, 19. Rf1+ .. Kg7, 20. Qe5+ .. Kh6, 21. Qh8 .. and what can black hope to achieve by playing on now.
15. ... Qg7, 16. Nd5 (Raf1 is also worthy of consideration) .. Bc5+ (is there anything else?), 17. Kh1 .. Qg6 (anything else and it looks like black gets mated), 18. Rg8 .. Kg7 (why am I bothering?), 19. RXQ (Nf4 might be even better) .. hXR, 20. Qe5+ .. Kg8, 21. Rf1 .. Nc6, 22. Nf6+ .. Kg7, 23. Ne8+ .. Kh6, 24. QXR and mate will soon follow.
15. ... Qe6, 16. Qg5+ .. Qg6, 17. RXB .. KXR, 18. Rf1+ .. Kg7, 19. Qe5+ .. Kh6, 20. QXR ... We have been here before. There is no hope now for black
15. ... Bc5+, seems pointless but whay not try it? 16. Kh1 .. Qe6, 17. Rg5+ (Nd5 also looks promising) .. Kf8, 18. Rf1+ (Nd5 still looks good) .. Ke7, 19. RXB .. Rf8 (getting the R into play at last and threatening a back rank mate), 20. QXh7+ .. Kd6 (white cannot play RXR due to Qe1 mate and now kXR is threatened so has black pulled something from the bag?). I suspect not but at least he has created some sort of chance although maybe Nd5 was better at moves 17 or 18.
15. ... Qd4+, desparate 16. Kh1 .. Qg7, 17. Raf1 .. Qg6, 18. RXB .. Kg7, 19. Rf1f7+ and its all over.
So black should play 16. Bc5+ not because it is the best but because it may just give him a chance of a swindle if white gets careless.
18 Feb 08
1 edit
Originally posted by Dragon FireJust realised I am a whole day behind on my analysis. Thats what comes from playing chess (badly) all weekend.
I have given up totally on black but it is worth considering just what exactly are blacks options as there are so few to look at.
15. ... Qe3+, 16. Kh1 .. Qe6, 17. Qg5+ (Raf1 might even be better) .. Qg6, 18. Rf8+ .. Kf8, 19. Rf1+ .. Kg7, 20. Qe5+ .. Kh6, 21. Qh8 .. and what can black hope to achieve by playing on now.
15. ... Qg7, 16. Nd5 (Raf1 is ...[text shortened]... t is the best but because it may just give him a chance of a swindle if white gets careless.[/b]
After 15. ... Qe6, 16. Qg5+ .. Qg6, 17. RXB .. KXR, 18. Rf1+ .. Kg7, 19. Qe5+ .. Kh6, 20. QXR ... and there is no hope now for black
I see I suggested 16. Raf1 earlier which seems the majority view. Is it better than Qg5? In this context better means quicker and why waste time on it if Qg5+ wins? Anyway here goes if 16. Raf1 .. Bg7 seems the only move, 17. Nd5 and what does black have? ... Nc6 presumably as he must try and get those pieces out, 18. Nf6+ .. BXN, 19. RXB .. Qe3+, 20. Kh1 .. Ne5, 21. Qe8+ .. Kg7 22. Qe7+ .. Kg8, 23. Rf8++.
Maybe black can improve on this but I can't see how other than throwing pieces in just to delay things.
18 Feb 08
Originally posted by Dragon FireIt seems that Qg5+ is the killer move. I haven't seen that the Queen can go to d8 (after Bg7).
[b]Just realised I am a whole day behind on my analysis. Thats what comes from playing chess (badly) all weekend.
After 15. ... Qe6, 16. Qg5+ .. Qg6, 17. RXB .. KXR, 18. Rf1+ .. Kg7, 19. Qe5+ .. Kh6, 20. QXR ... and there is no hope now for black
I see I suggested 16. Raf1 earlier which seems the majority view. Is it better than Q ...[text shortened]... ack can improve on this but I can't see how other than throwing pieces in just to delay things.[/b]