22 Sep 16
Originally posted by sonhouseAs I said, all of creation is God's Kingdom if all God did was say those who do evil get this
A personal email to each of us from God's comm would do the same, but that never happens so we have to rely on man made judgement day to simulate what a god could do in an instant.
there would be nothing but God's Word for it that goodness is better than evil. If any had
doubts they would remain since how would they know? I'm giving you my "views" on why
I do not know.
The struggle of good and evil really isn't a struggle, evil is but a bump on the road of
creation it is going to have a short life than its gone forever. Is this due to our ability to
choose that the whole of creation had to be open up to failure? Thinking about it I don't
see how God could avoid it, but then I don't all of creation as He does.
You again assume this is all man made, I don't see that at all.
22 Sep 16
Originally posted by SuzianneI tend to agree with KellyJay's point that not exercising one's free will does not entail that one does not have it. However, even if the remaining angels were not to have free will in the matter of serving God it would not entail that they could not have free will in other matters.
They don't have anywhere to go with 'free will'. They exist to serve God. When they exercise free will, what form do you think this takes? They stop serving God. They fall. Realistically, they have no free will except to choose to fall from grace.
It is not like human free will, because we can choose to follow God. Our exercise of free will does n ...[text shortened]... ree will. To exercise free will, they must give up grace. This is not free will as we know it.
Originally posted by KellyJayWhen your God speaks to me personally, after I get psychogically tested to make sure I am not hallucinating, I would believe you. Till then ALL of it is just humans telling me how a God is, what a God wants, how much God loves us all, I assume including the half BILLION who died in wars and from TB. God's love didn't due much for THEM now did it.
As I said, all of creation is God's Kingdom if all God did was say those who do evil get this
there would be nothing but God's Word for it that goodness is better than evil. If any had
doubts they would remain since how would they know? I'm giving you my "views" on why
I do not know.
The struggle of good and evil really isn't a struggle, evil is but a ...[text shortened]... t all of creation as He does.
You again assume this is all man made, I don't see that at all.
And of course you come back with, now they will have a better life in heaven. Which you have no way to prove, again just more words from the pens and mouths of humans.
22 Sep 16
Originally posted by sonhouseAgain, your complaint seems to be the things we do to each other not what God has done.
When your God speaks to me personally, after I get psychogically tested to make sure I am not hallucinating, I would believe you. Till then ALL of it is just humans telling me how a God is, what a God wants, how much God loves us all, I assume including the half BILLION who died in wars and from TB. God's love didn't due much for THEM now did it.
And of ...[text shortened]... eaven. Which you have no way to prove, again just more words from the pens and mouths of humans.
So God gives us a planet in a universe that has all we need to live in, and your upset that
we kill each other and blame God?
I told you earlier too, life and death for God isn't the same as it is for us, someone dying
doesn't end our lives it just takes us out of this life. Is there any complaint against God
you have that does not involve how we treat each other?
23 Sep 16
Originally posted by KellyJayYour alleged God has done nothing. 500 million dead in wars, religous and secular and one other cause, TB is proof there never was, never is, never will be any kind of help from this god, real or imagined.
Again, your complaint seems to be the things we do to each other not what God has done.
So God gives us a planet in a universe that has all we need to live in, and your upset that
we kill each other and blame God?
I told you earlier too, life and death for God isn't the same as it is for us, someone dying
doesn't end our lives it just takes us out of ...[text shortened]... ife. Is there any complaint against God
you have that does not involve how we treat each other?
If real, we are on our own. If imagined, we are on our own in the here and now, not some fake made up heaven where trillions of humans would live in some cloud world unable to advance, just syncophants to a jealous god who needs stroking 24 hours a day 7 days a week. Of course in your heaven, time itself may slow down to where you live a thousand years in a minute of Earthy time.
Of course that is all just exercises in imagination since the whole ediface is built on a house of cards. very weak house of cards.
23 Sep 16
Originally posted by sonhouseHow would you know what God has done? Again, you go on and on telling me what god
Your alleged God has done nothing. 500 million dead in wars, religous and secular and one other cause, TB is proof there never was, never is, never will be any kind of help from this god, real or imagined.
If real, we are on our own. If imagined, we are on our own in the here and now, not some fake made up heaven where trillions of humans would live in ...[text shortened]... s in imagination since the whole ediface is built on a house of cards. very weak house of cards.
would do and would not then tell me there is no such thing. You have NO CLUE, and for
all you know 500 million dead in wars could have been worse had He not acted.
Tell me anyone who died in wars 120 plus years ago would any of them still be alive
today had they not died during a war? For all you know death is just a natural part of life's
processes and you spout off as if that alone shows there is no god. Everyone dies, this
life is short that does not mean it is all there is.
Originally posted by KellyJayI didn't say what your alleged God has DONE. I am pointing out what it HASN'T done, it is no BS that 500 MILLION died from two sources, war and TB. That is real.
How would you know what God has done? Again, you go on and on telling me what god
would do and would not then tell me there is no such thing. You have NO CLUE, and for
all you know 500 million dead in wars could have been worse had He not acted.
Tell me anyone who died in wars 120 plus years ago would any of them still be alive
today had they not died ...[text shortened]... shows there is no god. Everyone dies, this
life is short that does not mean it is all there is.
THAT is what I am talking about not what your alleged God has DONE. It wasn't 500 mil dead in wars, that accounted for 'only' 200 million, the rest, 300 MILLION was from one disease, TB.
It could not possibly have been much worse, except for the plague in Europe where literally over 1/3 of the entire population of Europe was wiped out. Where was your alleged God then? Almost every one of those unfortunates were Christian. Fat lot of good it did THEM. Have you seen what death by plague looks like? It's a horrible death.
So your allegedly loving God didn't even ease their passage to death. Millions of criminals and despots die with riches around them, dying in bed under the best pallatives money can buy. And most of them not even Christian, maybe even atheists.
What a shame they got to have easy deaths while literally tens of millions of Christians died horrible deaths in the plagues of the 10th century, only belatedly found to be caused by fleas on rats.
Funny how your oh so loving God didn't even mention that one, eh.
You know, one word in the ear of one influential person could have saved LITERALLY millions of lives and now the result is a pretty significant lessening of genetic diversity in Europeans. Perhaps that doesn't mean much to you but genetic diversity is what makes humans less likely to die from disease and such.
Your alleged God cares little for any of that either.
And by again bringing up the 'so now you know the mind of god' card, you again belittle human intelligence. Humans ARE quite intelligent, at least the best of us, life changing intelligence. And it is clear that intelligence is what created all religions and no god was involved. All you have is the bible, conveniently written by men. So have your god prove otherwise if it listens to you, which it undoubtedly does not.
Originally posted by sonhouseWhat God has done allow us to live in a world where we make our evil choices and cause
I didn't say what your alleged God has DONE. I am pointing out what it HASN'T done, it is no BS that 500 MILLION died from two sources, war and TB. That is real.
THAT is what I am talking about not what your alleged God has DONE. It wasn't 500 mil dead in wars, that accounted for 'only' 200 million, the rest, 300 MILLION was from one disease, TB.
It ...[text shortened]... n by men. So have your god prove otherwise if it listens to you, which it undoubtedly does not.
us to live with the results of them. What God has done is show us a better way. What God
has done is deliver any who would answer His call into their lives. What God has done is
promise to never to leave us or forsake us in this evil world. What God has done is make
a way for each and everyone of us no matter how far away from God we have fallen
to be restored to God and receive God's grace, mercy, peace, and love in their lives.
What God has done is set a time for evil to run its course and all these things that cause
pain and suffering will end and be judged for what they do. What God has done is give us
grace and mercy even if we do not accept and reject Him, He allows us space to get right
with God. As long as that grace is offered we have a chance to give our wicked lives over
to God who can make our lives new as we turn our lives over to God.
Your claiming God isn't involved and going on and on about how God should act only
shows the only god you are really pissed at is the one you have created between your
ears. I suggest you look for the real one while you have the grace given you to do that.
24 Sep 16
Originally posted by sonhouseThe problem is that the psychologists wouldn't be able to tell if it was an hallucination or the real thing either. They might be able to rule out schizophrenia or some other chronic mental illness (or more likely just assume you had it and section you), but a third party can and will find some rationalization for that kind of experience.
When your God speaks to me personally, after I get psychogically tested to make sure I am not hallucinating, I would believe you. Till then ALL of it is just humans telling me how a God is, what a God wants, how much God loves us all, I assume including the half BILLION who died in wars and from TB. God's love didn't due much for THEM now did it.
And of ...[text shortened]... eaven. Which you have no way to prove, again just more words from the pens and mouths of humans.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anomalous_experiences
24 Sep 16
Originally posted by DeepThoughtI agree reality can be missed by all so we each walk out our lives in faith.
The problem is that the psychologists wouldn't be able to tell if it was an hallucination or the real thing either. They might be able to rule out schizophrenia or some other chronic mental illness (or more likely just assume you had it and section you), but a third party can and will find some rationalization for that kind of experience.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anomalous_experiences
24 Sep 16
Originally posted by sonhouseWhen God DOES speak to you, I get the feeling you're not going to like what he has to say.
When your God speaks to me personally, after I get psychogically tested to make sure I am not hallucinating, I would believe you. Till then ALL of it is just humans telling me how a God is, what a God wants, how much God loves us all, I assume including the half BILLION who died in wars and from TB. God's love didn't due much for THEM now did it.
And of ...[text shortened]... eaven. Which you have no way to prove, again just more words from the pens and mouths of humans.
25 Sep 16
Originally posted by DeepThoughtI don't think that there is a choice where we don't exercise our free will since doing or not doing something are both choices of will.
I tend to agree with KellyJay's point that not exercising one's free will does not entail that one does not have it. However, even if the remaining angels were not to have free will in the matter of serving God it would not entail that they could not have free will in other matters.