athiesist y r u in here

Originally posted by Penguin
Ouch Fabian,

You've mentioned this a few times and I think it needs proper discussion. Maybe not in this thread and maybe not even in this forum.

If the gravity experiment was re-done by dropping weights from the Tower of Pisa, then for one thing, the heavier object will hit the dirt first. Secondly, we do not know that the laws of physics (as we under ...[text shortened]... it an extra little push.

If you wish to respond, please start a new thread.

--- Penguin.

Originally posted by Penguin
If the gravity experiment was re-done by dropping weights from the Tower of Pisa, then for one thing, the heavier object will hit the dirt first.

Ouch Penguin, very much ouch!

The Galilei experiment really showed that objects falls with the same velocity independent of their masses. Experiments in space has shown that feathers falls exactly as fast as any other objects. If we take account of air resistance, then objects falls with different velocities, but that has nothing to do with gravitation. The gravitational constant is truly constant, the mass has nothing to do with it.
Isn't this shown in physics books for children in elementary schools?
A friend of mine, who apearantly was sick during that day in school honestely believed that 1 kg of led was heavier than 1 kg of cotton! I explained to him why he was wrong, but he wasn't easily convinced.

Originally posted by Penguin
we will eventually have to conclude that our understanding of the gravitational laws is incorrect.

Again ouch.

Yes we know.
If we couln't rely of the gravitational constant really is constant, then we couldn't build large structure, like bridges, sky-scrapers, and such. We couldn't do any space exploration, because we couldn't know the gravitational constants all its route. Satellites would fall, Voyager couldn't send us the pictures from Jupeter and Saturn. Apollo missions would be too dangerous. And so on.
We rely heavily that the gravitational constant really is constant. We measure it with a high degree of accuracy and we have never found any fluctuations.
And we are open to other possibilities. Trust me on that. We measure and remeasure every constant oftenly to get us another decimal, and another again, in order to perfect our measurement devices and theories. We would have known if the constans are not constants.

So, ouch Penguin, ouch!

Originally posted by realeyez
Before I started going to church I believed in everything else I study 11 different religions at the same same time which includes black magic. I did this for six years and I started to see things. Demons to be exact. I became a mental mess. I couldnt sleep, bruises would form on my body without reason. It was hell in a sence. Til one day when I was despara ...[text shortened]... I dont drink, I was not high for any of these events. Feel free to ask any questions you have.

Nice story.

I've had a similar experience. For several years, everyday at 4:52 in the afternoon, at least half a dozen monkeys used to fly out of my butthole. Then I prayed to Thor and it all stopped. Hail Thor!

Originally posted by realeyez
Before I started going to church I believed in everything else I study 11 different religions at the same same time which includes black magic. I did this for six years and I started to see things. Demons to be exact. I became a mental mess. I couldnt sleep, bruises would form on my body without reason. It was hell in a sence. Til one day when I was despara ...[text shortened]... I dont drink, I was not high for any of these events. Feel free to ask any questions you have.

A friend of mine saw deamons too, and heard voices.
But he is under care now, taking medicine, and lives a somewhat happy life now.

Originally posted by avalanchethecat
Just to clarify, here's what this forum is for:

[b]Debate and general discussion of the supernatural, religion, and the life after.

All welcome, regardless of belief or propensity to insult. If you're unhappy with a particular poster's attitude, alert the mods and they'll decide. My personal view is that when a debater resorts to insult, ...[text shortened]... t. Sometimes it's quite amusing. This forum would be ruined if the atheists stayed away![/b]

I guess my main objection would be if someone is new to whatever religious practice they are now involved in, but get talked out of it or became confused due to the statements that can be made. There are questions I recieve now that I did not know how to answer 7 or 8 years ago when I first got into the church. before I went to Bible college, before I knew how to research. The questions asked within this forum would have confused me and I wouldn't be who I am today. So my statement is mainly posed out of concern for those who are truly trying to gain understanding. For several years I didn't know how to properly read the Bible. The hermenneutics, understanding the economy in their time frame, whats applicable, to today's world from then etc.

Originally posted by Ullr
Nice story.

I've had a similar experience. For several years, everyday at 4:52 in the afternoon, at least half a dozen monkeys used to fly out of my butthole. Then I prayed to Thor and it all stopped. Hail Thor!

Thanks for proving my point. You've taken my real life expeirience and made a mockery out of it. People like this, you, are cruel. Should you ever wonder why the world is in a choatic state, simply look in the mirror. For all you know I could have been teased relentessly growing up and your last comment could have been the one to make me snap, and do something that you could hear on the news later on today. At one point in my life I was voilent, and angery, I'm not now. You should always think before you speak, you never no what fire you are fanning. Rather you want it or not I forgive you. I realize not everyone can be mature and carry conversations like an adult. I don't mean that in an insulting manner. That is a true statement. I didn't always know how myself.

Please consider those words I have lost many friends to gunfire (around 20) behind a silly joke that was made.

Originally posted by realeyez
I guess my main objection would be if someone is new to whatever religious practice they are now involved in, but get talked out of it or became confused due to the statements that can be made. There are questions I recieve now that I did not know how to answer 7 or 8 years ago when I first got into the church. before I went to Bible college, before I knew ...[text shortened]... erstanding the economy in their time frame, whats applicable, to today's world from then etc.

I don't understand your objections. Are you saying that you are afraid that atheists are bad teachers? Are you saying that only you Christians can give proper instruction to fellow Christians?
Are you going to ask all the other denominations to leave as well, or are they less likely to wrongly instruct your potential students?

If anyone is confused by statements made by atheists here, then that is well and good. It is not good to believe something that will cause you confusion when 'difficult' questions are asked.

Originally posted by karoly aczel
I, for one would like to hear one of your spiritual stories.

The only religon I follow is my own. Organized religon is counter-productive.

One story while at church a friend of mine her name is Loreda, had cancer. She got into the prayer line, because she had a meeting with her Doctor the next. The church prayed and laid hands etc. The next day the doctor could not find the cancer and she was cure. Cancer free ever since. I admit I do have others but they do sound crazy and made up. They are not, now I am not saying that if you or someone you know is dying and you pray for them that they will be healed. I dont know why God heals someone but not the other. I only saying that I have seen prayer work. I have seen some very dark things stuff you see in movies, and prayer (from some else got me thru)

Originally posted by twhitehead
I don't understand your objections. Are you saying that you are afraid that atheists are bad teachers? Are you saying that only you Christians can give proper instruction to fellow Christians?
Are you going to ask all the other denominations to leave as well, or are they less likely to wrongly instruct your potential students?

If anyone is confused by ...[text shortened]... good to believe something that will cause you confusion when 'difficult' questions are asked.

Yes and no, Im not asking all other denominations to leave, I said whatever spiritual practice they are learning. That goes beyond Christianity. There is a chinese proverb two loins can not live on the same mountain. meaning a student can not have two teachers. If I am new to Something like religion, or martial art fighting, how to shoot a basket ball etc. Receiving instruction from two people with two methods and ideas on how it should be done would confuse. Sinse I at this point would be learning whatever subject in this case Christainty. Two different belief systems could not teach me. I have no roots as of yet. I couldn't ask a non believer to explain what was meant when Jesus said You have turned my Fathers house into a den of thieves, or what was exactly meant when the bible states in the book of Timothy that women ought not to teach but should be silent. That does not mean that women around the world should not teach and be silent. But it does say that plainly.

If someone does not practice it how can they teach it. So a Christian should be the only one to instruct Christians. A muslim to a Muslim, a Jew to a Jew and so forth. In spiritual matters when you first get involved you are called a baby. Because spiritually you dont know nothing. You should only recieve instructions and question from your teacher. Those questions are meant to help guide you. The questions presented on this forum that I have seen, would cause doubt, and would stunt your grow, student is still a baby. Once you are rooted yes take on other harder questions. Im in this room but I am also rooted, I've taken several class, outside of college and within college. I dont know it all but I know how to research find the answers to the question. If I dont know, a beginner would not.

Originally posted by realeyez
Before I started going to church I believed in everything else I study 11 different religions at the same same time which includes black magic. I did this for six years and I started to see things. Demons to be exact. I became a mental mess. I couldnt sleep, bruises would form on my body without reason. It was hell in a sence. Til one day when I was despara ...[text shortened]... I dont drink, I was not high for any of these events. Feel free to ask any questions you have.

If you were my son, i would've taken you to the psychiatrist.

Originally posted by realeyez
I guess my main objection would be if someone is new to whatever religious practice they are now involved in, but get talked out of it or became confused due to the statements that can be made. There are questions I recieve now that I did not know how to answer 7 or 8 years ago when I first got into the church. before I went to Bible college, before I knew ...[text shortened]... erstanding the economy in their time frame, whats applicable, to today's world from then etc.

Thankfully the purpose of this forum is not to protect the delicate mental constructs of new converts to your, or any other religion. In any case, your concern is entirely misplaced, as if your hypothetical convert is actually seeking understanding they should probably restrict their reading to the Science forum.

Originally posted by realeyez
Yes and no, Im not asking all other denominations to leave, I said whatever spiritual practice they are learning. That goes beyond Christianity. There is a chinese proverb two loins can not live on the same mountain. meaning a student can not have two teachers.

And I totally disagree with that philosophy. I think that a student should seek out as many sources of information as he can and choose the best. If you restrict yourself to one teacher you are at risk of being mislead either deliberately or unintentionally. You will always end up with a biased view.
As an atheist I have never been afraid of difficult questions. If I cant answer them I will say so, and if I am interested in the answer I will try and find it, and am usually willing to listen to others suggestions regardless of their beliefs.

Besides, you cant protect a newbie Christian by telling the atheists to leave. You would get further by telling the newbie Christians to lock themselves up with their pastors till they are old enough to go out by themselves.

Originally posted by realeyez
Thanks for proving my point. You've taken my real life expeirience and made a mockery out of it. People like this, you, are cruel. Should you ever wonder why the world is in a choatic state, simply look in the mirror. For all you know I could have been teased relentessly growing up and your last comment could have been the one to make me snap, and do someth ose words I have lost many friends to gunfire (around 20) behind a silly joke that was made.

Personally I find keeping a sense of humor a virtue.

But if you want serious:

When I read your post about demons and levitating off your bed I find it laughable. No I do not believe it and quite frankly I find that combined with your response here an indication of your mental instability.

If becoming a follower of Jesus helped you off the ledge then I say good. In that case it is an example where spirtuality has done some good in the world. It's far better than prison, early death, or a straight jacket. I do believe spirtual fulfillment can be beneficial to us humans yet also believe there is more than one path to follow.

Good luck to you. You can expect irreverant humor from me from time to time.

Originally posted by FabianFnas
Originally posted by Penguin
[b]If the gravity experiment was re-done by dropping weights from the Tower of Pisa, then for one thing, the heavier object will hit the dirt first.

Ouch Penguin, very much ouch!

The Galilei experiment really showed that objects falls with the same velocity independent of their masses. Experiments in space ha ...[text shortened]... eories. We would have known if the constans are not constants.

So, ouch Penguin, ouch![/b]

I really opened up a can of worms there! I was not making myself clear at all was I?

It was wind resistance to which I was referring. I was not trying to say that our theories are wrong or that the gravitational constant is not a constant.

I know that if an experiment gave unexpected results in this area, we would first suspect an error in the experiment. Because of the general reliability of the theory, an error in the experiment would also be our 2nd, 3rd ... 100th assumption.

I was just being pedantic, honest!

--- Penguin.

giOriginally posted by realeyez
Why are there people who don't believe in anything in the spiritual room. These chats are for people who believe in something be it God, Jesus, Allah, Krishna etc...If you don't believe in anything go create or own section. I mainly read insults putting people down who have questions. Take your insults somewhere else please. It's not needed. I'm asking ni ...[text shortened]... tive manner, that only proves that you lack maturity and you have proven my point. Thank you

Perhaps mostly because atheism is a religion. Another reason could be that they are not neutral about the subject.

Originally posted by gambit3
Perhaps mostly because atheism is a religion. Another reason could be that they are not neutral about the subject.

“…Perhaps mostly because atheism is a religion….”

Atheism is, by definition, disbelief that there is a god. So atheism isn’t so much of a belief as a disbelief.
I assume that what you generally mean by “religion” includes the belief that there is at least one god? Or at the very least the belief that there exists a supernatural? ( although I don’t think most people would think that that is sufficient for it to be a religion)

So in what sense is atheism is a religion?