Call on Jesus 10 Times

@sonship said
@Ghost-of-a-Duke

Superstition, therefore no God.

A failed argument.

Instead of always pointing out flaws in other beliefs start a thread on the
great benefits of your atheism. And not in a peace-meal defensive way.

I don't take a clueless person to be really a liberal person.
I take a person who has something he stands for strongly to be a candid ...[text shortened]... You're not really liberal about other religions as much as clueless as to what you believe yourself.

I fully reject what you believe.

@Ghost-of-a-Duke

I fully reject what you believe.

I don't know whether to reject or accept what you believe because you don't know what to believe.

Well, that atheism makes any sense, that I reject.
And that Christ was concocted from human imagination, that I reject.

@sonship said
@Ghost-of-a-Duke

I fully reject what you believe.

I don't know whether to reject or accept what you believe because you don't know what to believe.

Well, that atheism makes any sense, that I reject.
And that Christ was concocted from human imagination, that I reject.

I believe that we live in an eternal universe, that our planet had the 8 ingredients necessary for life, that life is relatively common throughout the vast universe, that we evolved as a species, that Witness Lee has led you astray...

@Ghost-of-a-Duke

I believe that we live in an eternal universe, that our planet had the 8 ingredients necessary for life, that life is relatively common throughout the vast universe, that we evolved as a species, that Witness Lee has led you astray...

The science consensus at this time is that the universe was not always in the past.
It is also generally taught that the universe will grow cold in expansion and run down in the distant future.

Neither an eternal past universe nor an eternal future universe is generally believed in cosmology. Steady State theory has long gone out of popularity.

Einstein wanted very badly an eternal universe. To get it he introduced a cosmological constant into his equations to account for one. Latter he admitted that it was the biggest blunder of his career.

Where did the universe and all of its ingredients come from if it is not eternal?

@sonship said
@Ghost-of-a-Duke

I believe that we live in an eternal universe, that our planet had the 8 ingredients necessary for life, that life is relatively common throughout the vast universe, that we evolved as a species, that Witness Lee has led you astray...

The science consensus at this time is that the universe was not always in the past.
It is also generally ...[text shortened]... his career.

Where did the universe and all of its ingredients come from if it is not eternal?

But I told you, I 'do' think the universe is eternal.

You may parrot the beliefs of Lee but I don't do likewise with Einstein. Free thinking. Give it a try.

@Ghost-of-a-Duke

But I told you, I 'do' think the universe is eternal.

Okay. If you have that much faith, I understand that.
And I hardly belittle you because you do.

And who knows? Maybe tomorrow cosmologists will more agree with you.
Science opinions do change.

Did I belittle you?

You may parrot the beliefs of Lee but I don't do likewise with Einstein. Free thinking. Give it a try.

You belittle me though.

You belittle me by implying learning from others is not good and original.
And you belittle me by implying I cannot put two paragraphs together without
checking what was already written by someone else on it.

Do you learn any good chess from stronger players?

The red herring of always bringing up Witness Lee has not impressed me ever here that ideas are really being refuted.

So what you falsely accuse me of, you do.
At least you are now more proactively STANDING FOR SOMETHING and not just seating along the sideline only throwing stones at the Christian's belief and teaching.

But if time in the past had not beginning how could infinity be traversed so that it arrives at the present hour? Wouldn't this be as impossible as jumping your of a whole which had no bottom?

@sonship said
@Ghost-of-a-Duke

But I told you, I 'do' think the universe is eternal.

Okay. If you have that much faith, I understand that.
And I hardly belittle you because you do.

And who knows? Maybe tomorrow cosmologists will more agree with you.
Science opinions do change.

Religious opinions change too, and often contradict.

@sonship said
@Ghost-of-a-Duke

You belittle me by implying learning from others is not good and original.
And you belittle me by implying I cannot put two paragraphs together without
checking what was already written by someone else on it.

Do you learn any good chess from stronger players?

The red herring of always bringing up Witness Lee has not impressed m ...[text shortened]... t the present hour? Wouldn't this be as impossible as jumping your of a whole which had no bottom?

You follow a false teacher who's words are often non-scriptural and just plain weird.

Time is a human construct. We apply it to ourselves and the things around us for our own orientation. Did your God have a beginning? Why then the scepticism of a universe without a beginning?

@Ghost-of-a-Duke

You follow a false teacher who's words are often non-scriptural and just plain weird.

So then to follow a teacher who does not teach false teachings is OK then?

Second question: Why have you never been able to point out a false teaching that I follow? Refer me to the thread in which you an atheist proved I followed a "false teaching".

You splice some words from thousands of words and don't like what was said.
That doesn't make it a false teaching.

Time is a human construct. We apply it to ourselves and the things around us for our own orientation.

In other words I think you are saying our limitation of human language to express some things is evident.

Its not the limitation of only theists.
It is not scientific minded people who are exempt from the same limitation.

Did your God have a beginning?

By definition no.
If you are an atheist because you don't believe in a God who had a beginning, that makes sense to me. Neither would I believe such a thing.
Then the God you don't believe in is not the God I believe in.

I would say by definition God is eternal.

Why then the scepticism of a universe without a beginning?

Part of the skepticism is that the second law of thermodynamics tells us that
the whole thing is gradually running down.

Triple or quadruple the estimated age of the universe and it should presently be cold dark dispersed atoms, and maybe even not that.

An actual infinite of anything doesn't exist in the real world.
Infinite is a useful concept in mathematics.
No real infinity we know of actually exists.

And I think what you don't like about an eternal God and a non-eternal universe is simply the authority of the Creator. I think the though of divine authority raises a harsh blinking yellow light of caution and sounds an alarm of danger.

You might one day ask yourself WHY the thought of someone's ultimate authority is so objectionable to you. Do you feel it is a mortal threat to your autonomy?

@sonship said
@Ghost-of-a-Duke

You follow a false teacher who's words are often non-scriptural and just plain weird.

So then to follow a teacher who does not teach false teachings is OK then?

Second question: Why have you never been able to point out a false teaching that I follow? Refer me to the thread in which you an atheist proved I followed a "false teaching".

This has been done ad nauseam over two entire threads. Do you want to revisit them?

@sonship said
Time is a human construct. We apply it to ourselves and the things around us for our own orientation. [/quote]
In other words I think you are saying our limitation of human language to express some things is evident.

I am saying the finite can never comprehend the infinite.

@sonship said

Why then the scepticism of a universe without a beginning?
[/quote]

Part of the skepticism is that the second law of thermodynamics tells us that
the whole thing is gradually running down.

Triple or quadruple the estimated age of the universe and it should presently be cold dark dispersed atoms, and maybe even not that.

The eternal universe expands and contracts, expands and contracts. Matter has always existed, in one form or another.

@sonship said

And I think what you don't like about an eternal God and a non-eternal universe is simply the authority of the Creator. I think the though of divine authority raises a harsh blinking yellow light of caution and sounds an alarm of danger.

You might one day ask yourself WHY the thought of someone's ultimate authority is so objectionable to you. Do you feel it is a mortal threat to your autonomy?

Gobbledegook.

@Ghost-of-a-Duke

The eternal universe expands and contracts, expands and contracts. Matter has always existed, in one form or another.

You are hoping for a return to a pretty much discarded "Steady State" theory.
It has mostly been abandoned for a so-called "Big Bang" model.

Did I belittle your belief ?
I don't think so.