Can Forensic Science Trace the World’s Origins?

@ghost-of-a-duke said
To be clear Kelly, I do not reject the reality of God.

For me, there is 'no reality' to be rejected. What I reject is the idea of God put forward by other human beings. It's an important difference.

This seems to be a little at odds with your claim to be an atheist.

@deepthought said
This seems to be a little at odds with your claim to be an atheist.

It sounds rather close to my stance.

@ghost-of-a-duke said
To be clear Kelly, I do not reject the reality of God.

For me, there is 'no reality' to be rejected. What I reject is the idea of God put forward by other human beings. It's an important difference.

LOL you are dancing really fast here duke, but not going anywhere. You cannot say at the same time I have no beliefs about God while saying God isn't here. You cannot say at the same time I have no beliefs about God, but God didn't do it. You cannot say at the same time I have no beliefs about God then going on making counter claims about what God is and what God has done. You contradictions are showing with each claim you are making about God. You cannot say at the same time you don't reject the reality of God and saying there is no reality of God to reject, because one must know what one is rejecting and why for that would be true.

Your truth table about God with each statement of true false is a belief, be it a rejection or acceptance. If you ask me about my beliefs surrounding Thor I cannot say I have no beliefs concerning him, I do but I reject him as a real god and the only reason I can do that is I have beliefs about what God is and what gods are.

@kellyjay said
Yes

You believe that Adam and Eve were real people.

What do you know about them? What have you done to verify their
existence? What reliable factual sources have you consulted?

@handyandy said
You believe that Adam and Eve were real people.

What do you know about them? What have you done to verify their
existence? What reliable factual sources have you consulted?

I know what is written about them in scripture, since I told you I believe it that is the source. There wouldn't be any other than scripture, if there were, that would in my opinion cast doubt about them.

@handyandy said
You believe that Adam and Eve were real people.

What do you know about them? What have you done to verify their
existence? What reliable factual sources have you consulted?

Our of curiosity did you read the post about the three possible beginnings of everything and if so what do you think?

@kellyjay said
I know what is written about them in scripture, since I told you I believe it that is the source. There wouldn't be any other than scripture, if there were, that would in my opinion cast doubt about them.

Scripture is not a factual source. Nice story but no credible evidence.

@kellyjay said
Our of curiosity did you read the post about the three possible beginnings of everything and if so what do you think?

There are many more than three. The "beginning of everything," if there was one, is unknown.

@handyandy said
Scripture is not a factual source. Nice story but no credible evidence.

To you, but given the history of the scriptures in how it written and compiled I believe it’s the most incredible book there is.

@handyandy said
There are many more than three. The "beginning of everything," if there was one, is unknown.

Can you describe some of the others and show me how they differ? Beyond a different source any different sources would all be the same story.

@deepthought said
Well, to know something you have to have a belief. So you have at least two beliefs about Father Christmas, one that he wears a red coat and the other that he doesn't exist, at least in the literal sense.

I've been thinking about this recently so I'll write it in symbolic logic. Suppose we use G to denote the proposition "God exists" (and P to be any proposition). ¬ ...[text shortened]... would be like and so I don't think it's really possible to claim not to have any beliefs about God.

Sorry, this 'is' an interesting post and it wasn't my intention to ignore it. (Though you did lose me rather at 'symbolic logic' where you triggered childhood fears of Algebra).

I have knowledge of the notion of god/gods as described by others. And yes I have a mental concept of the god/gods having explored these notions. I emerge however with a disbelief that such god/gods exist. I do not think it is accurate to say that I have a belief that god/gods do not exist. 'Belief' is entirely in the lap of the person putting forward the notion of a deity. I have a non-belief in such a deity underpinned by a lack of compelling evidence on which to form a belief.

Or to put it another way - G+D-B x bah humbug = Disbelief in God is not in itself a belief.

@kellyjay said
LOL you are dancing really fast here duke, but not going anywhere. You cannot say at the same time I have no beliefs about God while saying God isn't here. You cannot say at the same time I have no beliefs about God, but God didn't do it. You cannot say at the same time I have no beliefs about God then going on making counter claims about what God is and what God has done. Y ...[text shortened]... a real god and the only reason I can do that is I have beliefs about what God is and what gods are.

To truncate my position.

1. God does not exist.
2. I reject the idea of God you have presented. (And it is to this 'idea of God' that I have made comment).
3. No comments I make about your 'idea of God' negate from point 1. (Our discussions are only academic).

@handyandy said
There are many more than three. The "beginning of everything," if there was one, is unknown.

How you come to believe if there is one it would be unknown? Doesn’t this assume that the cause also doesn’t care we know anything about it?

@kellyjay said
How you come to believe if there is one it would be unknown? Doesn’t this assume that the cause also doesn’t care we know anything about it?

Was there a cause? Are you uncomfortable with the idea that the answer is unknowable?

@handyandy said
Was there a cause? Are you uncomfortable with the idea that the answer is unknowable?

I believe it is knowable and everything around us speaks to this truth. As I also believe it made with intent.

You look at it all from a different starting place.