Originally posted by karoly aczel"Are you Christians listening to this?"
..Are you Christians listening to this?
A good post makes me forget the origonal op and takes me into the 'now' of the point at hand. In this way 'Spirituality' can go from anything to anything and I challenge anyone to say that the spirituality threads have to stay on topic. Thats the beuaty of true spirituality-it includes everything- albeit distorted sometimes...
Are you familiar with the whole context karoly? I wonder if you've ever read this. The following verses precede the parable.
Interestingly enough, it appears that the certain lawyer understands what he must do to have eternal life, but he then seeks to justify himself.
Luke 10: 22-29
All things are delivered to me of my Father: and no man knoweth who the Son is, but the Father; and who the Father is, but the Son, and he to whom the Son will reveal him. And he turned him unto his disciples, and said privately, Blessed are the eyes which see the things that ye see: For I tell you, that many prophets and kings have desired to see those things which ye see, and have not seen them; and to hear those things which ye hear, and have not heard them. And, behold, a certain lawyer stood up, and tempted him, saying, Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life? He said unto him, What is written in the law? how readest thou? And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself. And he said unto him, Thou hast answered right: this do, and thou shalt live. But he, willing to justify himself, said unto Jesus, And who is my neighbour?
The parable of the good Samaritan is an example of how one lives their life toward his/her neighbor in obedience to the law of God.
Originally posted by vistesdThank you, vistesd, for this. I am a big believer in giving with no strings attached. And you're right, that's exactly what the Samaritan did. It didn't matter to him who the man in the ditch was and neither did he seek to use the man's misfortune as an opportunity to evangelize. As much as I like sharing the Gospel, I hate the idea of helping someone with that ulterior motive in mind. It's disingenuous at best. The Samaritan's only concern was the man's well being.
Since Badwater mentioned parables as a secondary source, and I’m not sure if the parable of the Good Samaritan is apocryphal—
I have always thought that this parable propounds a strong lesson: The Samaritan does not ask the man in the ditch what his religion is, what he believes or does not believe, whether or not he is righteous, etc., etc. He does not ...[text shortened]... ause I no longer can keep track of the various disagreements as to what “true Christianity” is&hellip😉
Now, whether or not this parable is meant to teach a soteriology of illness and healing, well.... Let's just leave that can of worms unopened for the moment. 🙂
Originally posted by vistesdBut I don’t think Epi wants argument here; rather some ideas to feed his own thinking.
Hi Karoly! Hope you are well.
You know, I can’t remember many threads on here that stayed on topic anyway! And I’ve been here so long I remember when Epi showed up!
But I don’t think Epi wants argument here; rather some ideas to feed his own thinking.
So I’ll add this—
I do think that there are Biblical statements that take relative pre ...[text shortened]... detailed in terms of scriptural research. Epi could probably make many of my arguments for me.)
I don't want to seem like too much of a priss. Arguments may be necessary and unavoidable; I wouldn't dissuade anyone from challenging anything I put forth in this thread. Go ahead. If things get out of hand, so be it. As long as no one gets upset if I keep on listing Christ's practical teachings until I can't find any more. I'm really very interested in eventually compiling a critically-honed and succinct list. For my own edification, if not for someone else's.
Epi could probably make many of my arguments for me.)
LOL, I probably could, though not as eloquently, of course. 🙂
Originally posted by whodeyI think the Lord's prayer at least acknowledges the fact that God knows what we need before we even ask (e.g., "let your will be done..." ). Whether they contradict each other I suppose depends on how one uses the Lord's Prayer.
This is something I always wondered about. Do these contradict each other?
Originally posted by epiphinehasI've never known you to be a priss! I just didn't want to hijack the purpose of your thread.
[b]But I don’t think Epi wants argument here; rather some ideas to feed his own thinking.
I don't want to seem like too much of a priss. Arguments may be necessary and unavoidable; I wouldn't dissuade anyone from challenging anything I put forth in this thread. Go ahead. If things get out of hand, so be it. As long as no one gets upset if I k ...[text shortened]... arguments for me.)[/b]
LOL, I probably could, though not as eloquently, of course. 🙂[/b]
My point about the Samaritan is that I have always read that as a model of God's actions--which would challenge both faith-based and works-based models of salvationism. I'm just stomping old grounds, however, and don't even really know why.
Originally posted by vistesdWell said there Vistesd.
Since Badwater mentioned parables as a secondary source, and I’m not sure if the parable of the Good Samaritan is apocryphal—
I have always thought that this parable propounds a strong lesson: The Samaritan does not ask the man in the ditch what his religion is, what he believes or does not believe, whether or not he is righteous, etc., etc. He does not ...[text shortened]... ause I no longer can keep track of the various disagreements as to what “true Christianity” is&hellip😉
If I have to guess as to why churches play down this parable, I would say that it conflicts with other teachings that they consider more important. They teach salvation comes from faith alone and not works. They teach 'once saved, always saved'. According to that teaching the priest and Levite were already 'saved' and did not need to help the dying man. They teach that the only good works are the result of accepting Christ ie non-believers are incapable of doing good works. So according to them, the 'good works' of the Samaritan are filthy rags to God. Actually, I have heard some ridiculious interpretations of this parable from 'Christians' on this site that appear totally alien to what Christ intended.
Another lesson from the Good Samaritan parable is that the one Christ called 'good' and the one in line for salvation is a relative nobody who was looked down upon by the spiritual leaders of the time, while the priest and the Levite (spiritual leaders) did not do the will of Christ and were poor 'neighbours'.
I suspect that if the true meaning of this parable was taught, the churches would be half empty and not quite as rich.
I think faith & works are very intertwined. You can't have true works without faith yet your works alone will not get you saved either. Of course (we) should not just sit on our hands and do nothing and I admit I question modern Western Christianity at times because a total do nothing faith seems prevalent. (At least at some of the Churches I've been to)
Manny
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Originally posted by vistesdIt is not apocryphal. Most of his parables are not, but some are, such as the parable of the goats and the sheep.
Since Badwater mentioned parables as a secondary source, and I’m not sure if the parable of the Good Samaritan is apocryphal...
Originally posted by menace71I think you should read Romans 2 very carefully. Paul speaks of Gentiles who had no knowledge of the law of God ('faithless' by definition), but who do good works. Those Gentiles will receive salvation.
..You can't have true works without faith yet your works alone will not get you saved either.
The Practical Teachings of Christ (cont'd)
(36) Come to Me (Matt. 11:28)
(37) Take My yoke upon you (Matt. 11:29)
(38) Let Me teach you (Matt. 11:29)
(39) Put aside your selfish ambition (Matt. 16:24)
(40) Shoulder your cross (Matt. 16:24)
(41) Follow Me (Matt. 16:24)
(42) Turn from your sins (Matt. 18:3)
(43) Become as humble as little children (Matt. 18:3)
(44) Forgive your brothers and sisters in your heart (Matt. 18:35)
(45) Keep the commandments (Matt. 19:17)
(46) Do not murder (Matt. 19:18)
(47) Do not commit adultery (Matt. 19:18)
(48) Do not steal (Matt. 19:18)
(49) Honor your father and mother (Matt. 19:19)
(50) Love your neighbor as yourself (Matt. 19:19)
(51) If you believe, you will receive whatever you ask for in prayer (Matt. 21:22)
(52) Know the scriptures (Matt. 22:29)
(53) Know the power of God (Matt. 22:29)
(54) You must love the Lord your God with all your heart, all your soul, and all your mind (Matt. 22:37)
(55) Love your neighbor as yourself (Matt. 22:39)
(56) Don't ever let anyone call you, 'Rabbi' (Matt. 23:7)
(57) Don't address anyone here on earth as 'Father' (Matt. 23:9)
(58) Don't let anyone call you 'Master' (Matt. 23:10)
(59) The greatest among you must be a servant (Matt. 23:11)
(60) Humble yourself (Matt. 23:12)
(61) Tithe (Matt. 23:23)
(62) Do not leave undone justice, mercy and faith (Matt. 23:23)
(63) Don't let anyone mislead you (Matt. 24:4)
(64) Endure to the end (Matt. 24:13)
(65) If anyone tells you, 'Look, here is the Messiah,' or, 'There He is,' don't pay any attention (Matt. 24:23)
(66) If someone tells you, 'Look, the Messiah is out in the desert,' don't bother to go and look. Or 'Look, He is hiding here,' don't believe it (Matt. 24:26)
(67) Be prepared, because you don't know what day your Lord is coming (Matt. 24:42)
(68) Be ready all the time, the Son of Man will come when least expected (Matt. 24:44)
(69) Stay awake and be prepared, because you do not know the day or hour of My return (Matt. 25:12)
(70) Feed the hungry (Matt. 25:35)
(71) Give drink to the thirsty (Matt. 25:35)
(72) Be hospitable to strangers (Matt. 25:35)
(73) Give clothing to the naked (Matt. 25:36)
(74) Care for the sick (Matt. 25:36)
(75) Visit those in prison (Matt. 25:36)
(76) Take communion (Matt. 26:26-28)
(77) Keep alert and pray, otherwise temptation will over power you (Matt. 26:41)
(78) Go and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit (Matt. 28:19)
(79) Teach new disciples to obey all the commands I have given you (Matt. 28:20)
(80) Be sure of this: I am with you always, even to the end of the age (Matt. 28:20)
Originally posted by Rajk999You all miss an important aspect of the story of the Good Samaritan. The Samaritan and the Jew he helped were natural enemies. In fact, the same could be said for a rebellious and sinful human race in relation to a holy and just God. Also, the whole arguement over who is saved and who is not is of little consequence. The whole aim of the gospel is the redemption from sin. That is why Christ came and we see those who come to Christ who overcome sin in their lives and are victorious and those who do not for various reasons. It is what the gospel is all about. Its about the good news that we no longer need to be slaves to sin through the power of one Jesus Chrsit. I have experienced this has anyone else?
Well said there Vistesd.
If I have to guess as to why churches play down this parable, I would say that it conflicts with other teachings that they consider more important. They teach salvation comes from faith alone and not works. They teach 'once saved, always saved'. According to that teaching the priest and Levite were already 'saved' and did not nee of this parable was taught, the churches would be half empty and not quite as rich.
Originally posted by epiphinehasI personally think it is a template of sorts and not intended to be repeated mindlessly and continuously. For example, the beginining of the Lords prayer begins with praise with the words, "Hollowed be thy name". In other words, we should come to God with a sense of awe and worship etc.
I think the Lord's prayer at least acknowledges the fact that God knows what we need before we even ask (e.g., "let your will be done..." ). Whether they contradict each other I suppose depends on how one uses the Lord's Prayer.
Originally posted by whodeyIs the Songs of Solomon about Christ's love for the Church? Or is it what it says it is ... simply poetic details of Solomon and his lover/s?
You all miss an important aspect of the story of the Good Samaritan. The Samaritan and the Jew he helped were natural enemies. In fact, the same could be said for a rebellious and sinful human race in relation to a holy and just God. Also, the whole arguement over who is saved and who is not is of little consequence. The whole aim of the gospel is the r ...[text shortened]... e slaves to sin through the power of one Jesus Chrsit. I have experienced this has anyone else?
While you are free to add to what the Bible says at your own discretion, you often do so to your own detriment. Christ told the parable of the Good Samaritan in response to two questions "Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?" and "Who is my neighbour?". Christ would disagree totally with you .... this parable does in fact have a lot to do with who is saved.
Originally posted by vistesdHi Vistesd,indeed I'm well, I hope you are too. And if you're not its just probably just a 'temporary-ego-conflict'. 🙂
Hi Karoly! Hope you are well.
You know, I can’t remember many threads on here that stayed on topic anyway! And I’ve been here so long I remember when Epi showed up!
But I don’t think Epi wants argument here; rather some ideas to feed his own thinking.
So I’ll add this—
I do think that there are Biblical statements that take relative pre ...[text shortened]... detailed in terms of scriptural research. Epi could probably make many of my arguments for me.)
Thanks for clarifying the matter up for me. You've summed up the mood of this thread very succinctly-and I do get moody. In fact I'm not quite sure I read all the posts on this thread and have no doubt taken it out of context...