Originally posted by sonship
If you don't know how it started then you really don't know how it evolved.
Not true. Those are separate issues - evolution is right here for us to study, and we've learned that creatures generally get simpler and simpler into the past - which goes back further than we can see. So from there we can only extrapolate as to what happened earlier. Similar to our knowledge of the origin of the universe in a way.
Just use your imagination then. HOW do you think the process of Natural Selection FIRST got its kick start ?
Sea water and solar energy and tide-pools, perhaps. We've created some of the basic building blocks of dna and cells in the laboratory by using similar methods. Billions of years of this sort of thing and a self-reproducing structure can develop. Radiation can alter that structure so that a new generation is different from the previous. The race is on!
Imagine for me a scenario in which this "selection" mechanism applied for the first time. Theorize it.
Done, with no notes just as if I were being tested. Here, study this basic primer and uncover my mistakes:
https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Origin_of_life
Originally posted by apathistReally, you know that is what you are looking at, a pattern of changes that can be traced
'Simpler' isn't the right word to use here. I guess the fossil record shows a pattern of changes which we can trace into the past.
into the past. You are not looking at creatures that just look alike, that are not necessarily
related as distant relatives from one another, you know!?
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Originally posted by apathistHow do you know how far back the process goes if you don't know how it started?Originally posted by sonship
If you don't know how it started then you really don't know how it evolved.
Not true. Those are separate issues - evolution is right here for us to study, and we've learned that creatures generally get simpler and simpler into the past - which goes back further than we can see. So from there we can only e ...[text shortened]... y this basic primer and uncover my mistakes:
https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Origin_of_life
What if these changes have been going on for millions of years, what about hundreds
of thousands, tens of thousands, or thousands. Depending on the starting point, and the
cause of the process, both would add a great deal to our understanding, not having that
clear picture only adds to assumptions being made on evidence that is far in the past as
far as we are concern.
There are simpler lifeforms today, are they older than the more complex or are they just
different life forms and not as complex?
Originally posted by KellyJayThe theory came before the proof. We now have a solid handle on genetics and natural selection due to mutations. If God, then we know some of how he does his work.
Really, you know that is what you are looking at, a pattern of changes that can be traced
into the past. You are not looking at creatures that just look alike, that are not necessarily
related as distant relatives from one another, you know!?
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Originally posted by sonshipQuite so. If the dinosaurs hadn't been wiped out, then humans wouldn't be here at all. That doesn't make us sound very special. (Unless you believe God sent the meteorite?!)
Maybe the ones I recall as most vocal and most polemic find themselves forced to argue against the uniqueness of humanity.
Hard statistics on this I would not submit.
So the word "most" could be an exaggeration.
I'll rephrase it like this: Some of the more memorable encounters I had with atheists were with ones who argued for man not being necess ...[text shortened]... re far more successful than humanity, having occupied the earth for a far longer period of time.
Originally posted by Ghost of a DukeAnd not just dinos.
Quite so. If the dinosaurs hadn't been wiped out, then humans wouldn't be here at all. That doesn't make us sound very special. (Unless you believe God sent the meteorite?!)
There have been 5 or 6 global events that have almost wiped out life.
Next one due soon! 😀
Originally posted by apathistLOL, how do you know he wasn't looking for evidence to prove a point? I believe in
The theory came before the proof. We now have a solid handle on genetics and natural selection due to mutations. If God, then we know some of how he does his work.
evolution, but that doesn't mean what you are saying is true! We can have small changes
within creatures to give us a variety of a species, that does not mean at one time all life
on the planet was as simple as a worm or germ and over time we now see the variety we
see today.
Originally posted by KellyJayMankind may have been created wholesale by God? Possible, sure. Maybe Heaven's Gate people were right, too. Also maybe the Vikings were right that the key to the afterlife is to die in battle.
... We can have small changes within creatures to give us a variety of a species, that does not mean at one time all life on the planet was as simple as a worm or germ and over time we now see the variety we see today.
Originally posted by Ghost of a DukeI'm not sure how that answers my question, but OK.
Wise man say, when human look in mirror, he doesn't see whale or bird.
My pappy used to have a wise saying as well. He say, "If you can't stand the heat, don't come into the kitchen".
So instead of starting a thread on the implication that those of faith don't care about life, how bout looking in the mirror instead.