13 Mar 19
@moonbus saidI also asked if they are sapient, guessing that I was perhaps using the wrong word.
Yes, but this is not what “sentient” means. “Sentient” means capable of registering sense impressions and feelings; nothing to do with cognitive beliefs.
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/sentient
13 Mar 19
@fmf saidI think some of the posters here who think of themselves as theists are actually fideists. Are you familiar with that term?
You have suggested that my "change of mind after a life full of experience" is because I am willing member of "Satan's" rebellion, because I suffer from malignant narcissistic personality disorder, and because my ideas are like eating animal excrement.
What you haven't suggested is something like "...after years [FMF] just decided the evidence had mounted to the point ...[text shortened]... riginally thought".
No surprise there.
Did moonbus say something "mean" that you didn't like?
13 Mar 19
@moonbus saidThere have been several posters here over the years who believed that atheists are unable to understand faith etc. etc. ...and do not have access to knowledge about faith because they are "of the flesh" etc. etc. ...because faith has a kind of supernatural effect on the believer, meaning the non-believer is excluded etc. etc. I can't remember the Bible verse it's based on. Is that more or less fideism?
I think some of the posters here who think of themselves as theists are actually fideists. Are you familiar with that term?
- Joined
- 03 Jan 13
- Moves
- 13080
13 Mar 19
I am agnostic atheist who began searching for some evidence (or truth) of a god some 30 years ago.
You are both ? There is no advantage of claiming to be "an agnostic atheist."
No such evidence ( or truth) exists, although it may be hidden.
You are an agnostic, it sounds to me.
Sorry, you can't benefit from the prestige of claiming atheism.
But you don't care about the prestige but about finding truth. Right?
I mean it is kind of cool to be an Atheist for some people. Its has a kind of "rite of passage" in a modern world.
I have come to conclusions concerning Judaism, Christianity and Islam.
Judaism : An amalgamation of pagan religions
Christianity : An amalgamation of Judaism and pagan religions with a resurrection cult or 2 thrown in. (See Zalmoxis)
Islam : An amalgamation of Judaism and Christianity.
So if you're an agnostic then the truth that you say may be hidden, may be "hidden" in all this mess you describe?
I believe it is an important part of any search process to strive to uncover what is NOT true. In chess, most players would reject the first move by white 1. h4 as a probability that it could be the best move.
[quote] No one has uncovered any truth to the existence of a god but, I agree, it would be nice to know.
Perhaps it is just too far beyond our comprehension to unravel this mystery.
God is not real to you. You have to start with why God is not real to you.
There is an insulation that has cut off the touching of the living God to you. There is an obstacle which has become a barrier between you and the God who is there.
Understanding the there is this wall between you too and how it is removed will make the substantiating of the reality of God subjectively experiencial in your life.
And nobody will be able to take that knowledge away. For humans cannot give it. And neither can humans remove it from you once you have it.
The barrier between you and God is not something very interesting. You might find it boring. But it is the barrier.
Your sins.
Your sins have made a separation between you and God.
When the problem of your real sins which have occasioned real guilt is dealt with, there will be no obstacle forbidding the touching inwardly of the living God.
Your sins have made a separation between you and God.
You need the guilt of your sins forgiven that the intervening barrier be removed.
Save yourself another 30 years. Your sins have made a separation so that you cannot touch God within. You need forgiveness and justification in Christ's redemptive work.
13 Mar 19
@sonship saidBeing able to refer to one's stance succinctly is an "advantage".
You are both ? There is no advantage of claiming to be "an agnostic atheist."
Oh no, you're not going to use sonship refuses to understand what 'agnostic atheist' means as some kind of Debating Point, are you?
13 Mar 19
1 edit
@sonship saidThe barrier between you and God is not something very interesting. You might find it boring. But it is the barrier.
Your sins.
Your sins have made a separation between you and God.
When the problem of your real sins which have occasioned real guilt is dealt with, there will be no obstacle forbidding the touching inwardly of the living God.
Your sins have made a separation between you and God.
You need the guilt of your sins forgiven that the intervening barrier be removed.
Save yourself another 30 years. Your sins have made a separation so that you cannot touch God within. You need forgiveness and justification in Christ's redemptive work.
You just haven't figured out how to talk to non-believers, even after all these years, have you?
The audience for this recitation of dogma is presumably people who already believe what you are saying.
- Joined
- 14 Mar 15
- Moves
- 29595
13 Mar 19
@kellyjay saidI do, and they don't.
You don't know that! For all you know they cry because of their knowledge of who He is and what we are.
- Joined
- 14 Mar 15
- Moves
- 29595
13 Mar 19
@suzianne saidI don't think it matters if they know or not that they are atheists. This has no bearing on them being void of the divine, in the early years of their lives.
I just think calling an infant an atheist is putting too fine a point on the argument. There's no cognition to bring to bear on the question.
In other words, do they know they are an atheist?
A child is also born void of any knowledge about driving a car. Would calling an infant a 'non-car driver' also be 'putting too fine a point on the argument'? And would it make any difference if the infant had no knowledge that he wasn't a car driver?
- Joined
- 14 Mar 15
- Moves
- 29595
13 Mar 19
@moonbus saidIs a brave man sir who refers the Ghost to a dictionary.
Yes, but this is not what “sentient” means. “Sentient” means capable of registering sense impressions and feelings; nothing to do with cognitive beliefs.
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/sentient
Sentience is the ability to 'perceive or feel things' which is sufficient to render sonship's computer mouse quip a nonsense. - Would you not equate sentient 'perception' with my reference to 'awareness' of the divine?
- Joined
- 01 Oct 04
- Moves
- 12095
13 Mar 19
@fmf saidWhen you were a Christian did you at any point decide to follow Jesus or did you simply realize one day that you were a Christian?
I'm not sure yet.
I can't just decide to be one, obviously.
But I can - and maybe one day will - decide to declare that I am one if I realize that it is what I am.
It's a process not a decision.
What will theists make of this if it happens?
And what will atheists make of it?
Thoughts and pertinent YouTube clips welcome.
@dj2becker saidOh my gosh, was it a head injury in some sort of accident, or have you developed dementia maybe? I’m so sorry to see that you have completely lost your memory....
When you were a Christian did you at any point decide to follow Jesus or did you simply realize one day that you were a Christian?
- Joined
- 14 Mar 15
- Moves
- 29595
@divegeester saidI think he just hit 'reset.'
Oh my gosh, was it a head injury in some sort of accident, or have you developed dementia maybe? I’m so sorry to see that you have completely lost your memory....
- Joined
- 03 Jan 13
- Moves
- 13080
13 Mar 19
1 edit
Sentience is the ability to 'perceive or feel things' which is sufficient to render sonship's computer mouse quip a nonsense. - Would you not equate sentient 'perception' with my reference to 'awareness' of the divine?
Okay, my computer mouse is not sentient and therefore is not an atheist.
How about baby kitten? Is it an atheist ?
How about a brand new amoeba? Is it an atheist?
I did not see a definition yet of sentience which means awareness of the divine.