26 Nov 05
Originally posted by vistesdWhy did you stop being a believer in Christ? I'm curious, because the exact opposite is happenning to me. When I was young, I used to burn Bibles and hang out with anti-Christian people. Now, at age 44, and with some medical problems (not life threatening) that may change my life in the next few years, I find myself becoming more closer to God and caring less if I die today or in 50 years....it could be the meds that I'm taking for my condition, which I hope will turn out to be temporary, but I still feel the love of God in my suffering...
Well, Chance, I think we probably disagree profoundly across-the-board on the whole religious question—especially since I am no longer a Christian, so I don’t share your beliefs about salvation, for instance, or that the Bible is the “word of God.” I’m not trying to buy my way anywhere; then again, I’m not big on the “eat, drink and merry” thing either—age perhaps… 🙂
26 Nov 05
Originally posted by chancremechanicIt's the meds.
Why did you stop being a believer in Christ? I'm curious, because the exact opposite is happenning to me. When I was young, I used to burn Bibles and hang out with anti-Christian people. Now, at age 44, and with some medical problems (not life threatening) that may change my life in the next few years, I find myself becoming more closer to God an ...[text shortened]... which I hope will turn out to be temporary, but I still feel the love of God in my suffering...
Do you think your family cares if you die today or in 50 years? This is the danger of the illusion of xtianity...which of the faithful in this forum says xtianity "sanctifies life"? Seems to me it "sanctifies" death by placing abnormal expecations of a hereafter.
26 Nov 05
Originally posted by David CBeing at peace with death is different than being eager for death.
It's the meds.
Do you think your family cares if you die today or in 50 years? This is the danger of the illusion of xtianity...which of the faithful in this forum says xtianity "sanctifies life"? Seems to me it "sanctifies" death by placing abnormal expecations of a hereafter.
26 Nov 05
Originally posted by The Chess ExpressI don't disagree. Being at peace with the inevitable is fine (another example of the security-blanket nature of religion), but I was responding to chance's post. He "doesn't care" if he dies today, or in 50 years. I surmise it's because he's "sure" that he'll be hanging out with Jesus. I was pointing out, he might have loved ones who feel differently.
Being at peace with death is different than being eager for death.
26 Nov 05
Originally posted by David CI was pointing out, he might have loved ones who feel differently.
I don't disagree. Being at peace with the inevitable is fine (another example of the security-blanket nature of religion), but I was responding to chance's post. He "doesn't care" if he dies today, or in 50 years. I surmise it's because he's "sure" that he'll be hanging out with Jesus. I was pointing out, he might have loved ones who feel differently.[/b]
Good point then. I don't want my loved ones dying in the near future either.
26 Nov 05
Originally posted by David CMabey his medical condition causes a loss of friends?
I don't disagree. Being at peace with the inevitable is fine (another example of the security-blanket nature of religion), but I was responding to chance's post. He "doesn't care" if he dies today, or in 50 years. I surmise it's because he's "sure" that he'll be hanging out with Jesus. I was pointing out, he might have loved ones who feel differently.
26 Nov 05
Originally posted by chancremechanicI think you miss the point - being that we should act well out of love and not fear. We should act well not in the hope of a reward but because we care about other people (or perhaps, from your point of view, because we are inspired to do so).
That Methodist minister did his congregation a disservice by telling such a "story"....it gives people a reason to "eat, drink, and be merry" in the last days, as in the days of Noah, in the false hope that no matter what all the good they did on earth, it still will not buy one's way into Heaven according to the scriptures.....
It is only an excuse to "eat, drink and be merry" if we believe that there can be no morality without religion (more specifically the "carrot" of heaven and the "stick" of hell).
Surely even Christians don't believe that? And surely that isn't why a Christian shows love? If it is, then it is precisely that - a show of love, not love itself.
26 Nov 05
Originally posted by dottewellIt's just sexier this way.
I think you miss the point - being that we should act well out of love and not fear. We should act well not in the hope of a reward but because we care about other people (or perhaps, from your point of view, because we are inspired to do so).
26 Nov 05
Originally posted by chancremechanicYou burned Bibles? Yikes.
Why did you stop being a believer in Christ? I'm curious, because the exact opposite is happenning to me. When I was young, I used to burn Bibles and hang out with anti-Christian people. Now, at age 44, and with some medical problems (not life threatening) that may change my life in the next few years, I find myself becoming more closer to God an ...[text shortened]... which I hope will turn out to be temporary, but I still feel the love of God in my suffering...
One possibility for why after so long you've begun to think irrationally, did you play with any ouija boards?
26 Nov 05
Originally posted by The Chess ExpressThat's the poiint of my extra point there chessEX. While God is supremely patient with the unrepentent sinner, willing to forgive not only a handful of childish sins, but a lifetime of grievious ones, He holds on to the repentent heart with an eternal grasp, even if the mind changes or wavers or doubts.
[b]The really good news is that one can change his mind after rejecting Jesus! He is always ready, willing and able to listen to the repentent! Interestingly, once a person chooses Jesus, admitting his need to be saved and letting Jesus do His saving work, he can not UNrepent! Once God hears your sincere cry for help, he not only forgives your s ...[text shortened]... I find this hard to agree with. Take howardgee for example. People's minds are always changing.
Romans 8:38
For I am convinced that neither death nor life, neither angels nor demons neither the present nor the future, nor any powers, 39neither height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God that is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Ephesians 4:30
And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, with whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.
Perhaps someone, as you mentioned, will change his mind about the reality of salvation in Christ, but that does not have any effect on the actual salvation in Christ. And while such a person may chafe under the idea that he is being saved anyway, he will certainly be glad when he finds himself in heaven, with his eyes and mind widely opened to the truth, that God did not let him 'off the hook', as it were.
No, you cannot unrepent. Of course there are those who may have thought they had repented, or who may claim they have repented, but
when God looked at the heart, as is His wont, He found the repentence to be false, and the salvation only supposed. Such a person can't ever really UNrepent for obvious reasons.
27 Nov 05
Originally posted by chancremechanicI am too dim to work you out!?
I think you are just too dim to figure me out, Howard. I am such a complex person that my wife has trouble keeping up with me; you stand no chance. Just stay on the elementary level of the topic of God, rapists, child molestors, and everything that makes the world what it is that makes you satisfied and you'll be OK while you're here on earth. A ...[text shortened]... ggest you read the New Teastament, startinmg with John, and see what you are missing...good luck
Thanks for the best laugh I have had in years.
Keep reading the bible yourself; fortunately I am too wise to believe a contradictory book written in times of immense ignorance.
Better still, why don't you try and read a much more enlightened tome; "Why I am not a Christian" by Bertrand Russell.
27 Nov 05
Originally posted by chancremechanicOh, so this explains a lot.
Why did you stop being a believer in Christ? I'm curious, because the exact opposite is happenning to me. When I was young, I used to burn Bibles and hang out with anti-Christian people. Now, at age 44, and with some medical problems (not life threatening) that may change my life in the next few years, I find myself becoming more closer to God an ...[text shortened]... which I hope will turn out to be temporary, but I still feel the love of God in my suffering...
Suddenly faced with your own mortality and impending doom, you cling onto the bible's bull about eternal life in Heaven.
Be a man CM. Face death with your head held high, instead of humiliating yourself pandering to some none-existent Diety to attempt to enter a place which does not exist.
28 Nov 05
Originally posted by howardgeeSuddenly faced with your own mortality and impending doom...
Oh, so this explains a lot.
Suddenly faced with your own mortality and impending doom, you cling onto the bible's bull about eternal life in Heaven.
Be a man CM. Face death with your head held high, instead of humiliating yourself pandering to some none-existent Diety to attempt to enter a place which does not exist.
Why the connection between mortality and doom Howard? Where does that come from?
If eternal life in Heaven is 'the Bible's bull', then eternal life in hell would also be bull. Either both are lies, or they are both true.