Originally posted by reinfeldYep, spot on. Should be called the "no spirituality" forum or the "philosophy of religion" forum.
this is the end of my visit to the spirtuality forum. very rancourous.
I don't know if there are any mormons on this forum but perhaps they would explainsome of thier beliefs? No1 claims to know a lot about them - maybe he was one once?
Whodey: I've also read and was told by a mormon I used to know very well, all the same info you posted. However I find the mormon religion quite secretive also.
An intersting question to ask them or the JWs is: "what do I have to do to be forgiven my sins and saved?"
Originally posted by divegeesterIndeed. It is a far cry from the open ministry of Christ. Perhaps they should take note!!
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Whodey: I've also read and was told by a mormon I used to know very well, all the same info you posted. However I find the mormon religion quite secretive also.
An intersting question to ask them or the JWs is: "what do I have to do to be forgiven my sins and saved?"[/b]
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Originally posted by divegeester (in bold)
Yep, spot on. Should be called the "no spirituality" forum or the "philosophy of religion" forum.
The philosophy of religion? That would be accurate and there's nothing wrong with that. Most people are going to take exception to (read: debate) spiritual beliefs (or the lack thereof) that are different from their own. There is a great deal of intolerance in beliefs that are diametrically opposed to one's own. Hey, I'm a part of that; I no longer harbor any tolerance for religious opinion that excludes facts, women, cultures, races; you name it - religion is too often the crutch for allowing intolerant views and behavior that marginalizes others. No more for me. I will speak against it and I will in strong terms. I will not allow those views anywhere near me in my home, my business, in the places that I go. I will call any injustice for what it is and say "It is not so." If that offends someone's belief system, hey, that's tough - they're just words.
I don't know if there are any Mormons on this forum but perhaps they would explain some of their beliefs?
I know a great deal about Mormons. I disagree with a lot of what and how they believe, but I know what they believe and their praxis of that belief. What sort of enlightenment would you expect to gain from an explanation of beliefs?
Originally posted by BadwaterAgreed. My point was about the (forum based) intollerance, snipping and bad mouthing that goes on in this forum just becuase someone disagrees with someone else, often causing the debate to break down. I'm not religious (at least I don't think I am), I have spiritual beliefs and would call myself a christian only to be identified with christ. Personally I don't identify with or recognise as 'christian' any of the other man made historical baggage, and modern day comedy that much of organised christianity as become.
Originally posted by divegeester (in bold)
[b]Yep, spot on. Should be called the "no spirituality" forum or the "philosophy of religion" forum.
The philosophy of religion? That would be accurate and there's nothing wrong with that. Most people are going to take exception to (read: debate) spiritual beliefs (or the lack thereof) that are di ...[text shortened]... What sort of enlightenment would you expect to gain from an explanation of beliefs?[/b]
I'm interested in hearing mormons clarify thier beliefs which others here may be speculating about.
i will tell you one thing about lds women. they are not degraded as a poster noted. the amish, the mennonite and the anabaptists are all "preservative christians" who have patriachial societies...( as well as orthodox jews ). this is not degrading of women. it is a structure that divides duties that reflects regligious teaching and can also be seen in the natural world ( where is mufasa when you need him ? ). the mormons view eve of the garden as not the first to sin as do mainline christians ( being tempted by satan to seek the forbidden fruit ) but as a free woman who chose thru free will agency to create children by
taking from the tree, etc. the mormon mother is the bedrock of the family. mormon children are raised not to drink, swear or have pre-marital intercourse ( and of course individuals fail here and there as they are only people ) because they try to stay at home to raise the family in the years when children need a mother.
Originally posted by reinfeldInteresting post thanks.
mormons view eve of the garden as not the first to sin as do mainline christians ( being tempted by satan to seek the forbidden fruit )
This piece about christianity is scripturaly incorrect though. Sin entering the world is acredited to be through Adam, and the Lord primarily held him responsible. Eve was punished for her disobedience, and chronologically sinned before Adam, but is he who is responsible, not Eve.
Rom 5:12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned.
you are correct. adam is held responsible as he agreed to eve's decision. also i would point out that the mormons do not believe in original sin ( pretty sure about this ) and the atonement of the christ was for adam's error. we all start out without sin and if we fall into it the atonement of the christ also acts as our salvation for it but we did not inherit adam's error at our birth ( but lds people should correct me here if i have misspoke ...
Originally posted by reinfeldOther posters have claimed that Mormons accept the bible doctrines, I completely disagree with that; your example of original sin is a case in point.
you are correct. adam is held responsible as he agreed to eve's decision. also i would point out that the mormons do not believe in original sin ( pretty sure about this ) and the atonement of the christ was for adam's error. we all start out without sin and if we fall into it the atonement of the christ also acts as our salvation for it but we did not i ...[text shortened]... erit adam's error at our birth ( but lds people should correct me here if i have misspoke ...
Originally posted by divegeesteractually the difference was that Eve was mislead while Adams sin was a deliberate act of disobedience.
Interesting post thanks.
This piece about christianity is scripturaly incorrect though. Sin entering the world is acredited to be through Adam, and the Lord primarily held him responsible. Eve was punished for her disobedience, and chronologically sinned before Adam, but is he who is responsible, not Eve.
Rom 5:12 Wherefore, as by one man sin ent ...[text shortened]... ed into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned.
the mormons use the king james version as official canon. before his death joseph smith was editing the kjv to show a newer understanding but the work was not completed before his murder at carthage. i agree that lds does not accept the bible in the way that say the southern baptist would. the book of mormon and the other parts of the lds canon would interpret things differently than say the typical baptist preacher and so that is one of the reasons why lds are charged with being non-christian. lds also belive that mary is a virgin at conception but not at the birth of christ. a very fundamental difference with mainline christianity.
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Originally posted by reinfeldThis would depend on what you call degrading. If the spirituality, the afterlife, is what is important then the Mormon theology does degrade women by holding them as being lesser in a spiritual sense. A woman must be sealed with a man for salvation, with one man; however, a man may be sealed with any number of women, and his salvation comes from elsewhere and sealing for salvation is not mandatory. This is just one example of many, and their talk is just talk - in theology and praxis a different message stems forth.
i will tell you one thing about lds women. they are not degraded as a poster noted. the amish, the mennonite and the anabaptists are all "preservative christians" who have patriachial societies...( as well as orthodox jews ). this is not degrading of women. it is a structure that divides duties that reflects regligious teaching and can also be seen in t ...[text shortened]... because they try to stay at home to raise the family in the years when children need a mother.