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Originally posted by menace71
Well if He Jesus was the arch angel Micheal? When then could angels become flesh? Then after becoming flesh turn back into an angel? Just seems vary confusing to me.
Actually not that confusing at all I'm showing the doctrines that are off is all.





Manny

are you unaware of the Nephalim, who were originally angels and that manifested human form? Were not the 'men', who visited Abraham, angels in human form? Was not the angel that battled with Israel in human form?

Originally posted by menace71
Etymology From Wikipedia of course

The etymology of the Hebrew word נְפִילִים (nephilim) means "fallen ones."[1][2][3]

Abraham ibn Ezra proposes that they were called fallen ones because men's hearts would fail at the sight of them. Some suggest that they were giants and when they fell, the cal or actual (see below on Anakim).

(Don't know why it posted like that?)

Manny

(Genesis 6:4) . . .The Nephilim proved to be in the earth in those days, and also after that, when the sons of the [true] God continued to have relations with the daughters of men and they bore sons to them, they were the mighty ones who were of old, the men of fame. . .

NEPHILIM

(Nephilim) [Fellers; Those Who Cause [Others] to Fall Down].
This is a transliteration of the Hebrew word nephilim;, plural in its three occurrences in the Bible. (Ge 6:4; Nu 13:33 [twice]) It evidently stems from the causative form of the Hebrew verb naphal (fall) as found, for example, in 2 Kings 3:19; 19:7.

The Bible account describing Jehovahs displeasure with men in the days of Noah before the Flood relates that “the sons of the true God” took for themselves wives from among the attractive daughters of men. It then mentions the presence of “Nephilim,” saying: “The Nephilim proved to be in the earth in those days, and also after that, when the sons of the true God continued to have relations with the daughters of men and they bore sons to them, they were the mighty ones [Heb., haggibborim] who were of old, the men of fame.”—Ge 6:1-4.

Identity.
Bible commentators, considering verse 4, have offered several suggestions as to the identity of these Nephilim. Some have thought that the derivation of the name indicates that the Nephilim had fallen from heaven, that is, that they were ‘fallen angels’ who mated with women to produce “mighty ones . . . the men of fame.” Other scholars, focusing their attention particularly on the statement “and also after that” (vs 4), have said the Nephilim were not the ‘fallen angels’ or the “mighty ones,” since the Nephilim “proved to be in the earth in those days” before the sons of God had relations with women. These latter scholars hold the opinion that the Nephilim were simply wicked men like Cain—robbers, bullies, and tyrants who roamed the earth until they were destroyed by the Flood. Still another group, taking into consideration the context of verse 4, conclude that the Nephilim were not themselves angels, but were the hybrid offspring resulting from materialized angels having intercourse with the daughters of men.

Same as “gibborim;.
Certain Bible translations adjust the location of the phrase “and also after that,” placing it near the beginning of verse 4, thus identifying the Nephilim with the “mighty ones,” the gibborim;, mentioned in the latter part of the verse. For example: “In those days, as well as afterward, there were giants [Heb., hannephiim] on the earth, who were born to the sons of the gods whenever they had intercourse with the daughters of men; these were the heroes [Heb., haggibborim] who were men of note in days of old.”—Ge 6:4, AT; see also Mo, NIV, and TEV.

The Greek Septuagint also suggests that both the “Nephilim” and “mighty ones” are identical by using the same word gigantes (giants) to translate both expressions.
Reviewing the account, we see that verses 1 to 3 tell of “the sons of the true God” taking wives and of Jehovah’s statement that he was going to end his patience with men after 120 years. Verse 4 then speaks of the Nephilim proving to be in the earth “in those days,” evidently the days when Jehovah made the statement. Then it shows that this situation continued “after that, when the sons of the true God continued to have relations with the daughters of men,” and describes in more detail the results of the union of “the sons of the true God” with women.

Who were the ‘sons of God’ that fathered the Nephilim?

Who were “the sons of the true God” that were involved?
Were they men who were worshipers of Jehovah (as distinguished from the general run of wicked mankind), as some claim? Evidently not. The Bible implies that their marriage to the daughters of men resulted in whipping up the badness in the earth. Noah and his three sons, along with their wives, were the only ones in God’s favor and were the only ones preserved through the Deluge.—Ge 6:9; 8:15, 16; 1Pe 3:20.

Hence, if these “sons of the true God” were merely men, the question arises, Why were their offspring “men of fame” more than those of the wicked, or of faithful Noah? Also, the question might be asked, Why mention their marriage to the daughters of men as something special? Marriage and childbearing had been taking place for more than 1,500 years.

The sons of God mentioned at Genesis 6:2, therefore, must have been angels, spirit “sons of God.” This expression is applied to angels at Job 1:6; 38:7. This view is supported by Peter, who speaks of “the spirits in prison, who had once been disobedient when the patience of God was waiting in Noah’s days.” (1Pe 3:19, 20) Also Jude writes of “the angels that did not keep their original position but forsook their own proper dwelling place.” (Jude 6) Angels had the power to materialize in human form, and some angels did so to bring messages from God. (Ge 18:1, 2, 8, 20-22; 19:1-11; Jos 5:13-15) But heaven is the proper abode of spirit persons, and the angels there have positions of service under Jehovah. (Da 7:9, 10) To leave this abode to dwell on earth and to forsake their assigned service to have fleshly relations would be rebellion against God’s laws, and perversion.

The Bible states that the disobedient angels are now “spirits in prison,” having been ‘thrown into Tartarus’ and “reserved with eternal bonds under dense darkness for the judgment of the great day.” This seems to indicate that they are greatly restricted, unable again to materialize as they did prior to the Flood.—1Pe 3:19; 2Pe 2:4; Jude 6.

Increased Wickedness.
“The mighty ones who were of old, the men of fame” that were produced by these marriages, were not men of fame with God, for they did not survive the Flood, as did Noah and his family. They were “Nephilim,” bullies, tyrants, who no doubt helped to make conditions worse. Their angelic fathers, knowing the construction of the human body and being able to materialize, were not creating life, but lived in these human bodies and, cohabiting with women, brought forth children. Their children, “mighty ones,” were therefore unauthorized hybrids. Apparently the Nephilim did not, in turn, have children.

In Mythology.
The fame and dread of the Nephilim, it appears, gave rise to many mythologies of heathen people who, after the confusion of languages at Babel, were scattered throughout the earth. Though the historical forms of the Genesis account were greatly distorted and embellished, there was a remarkable resemblance in these ancient mythologies (those of the Greeks being only one example), in which gods and goddesses mated with humans to produce superhuman heroes and fearful demigods having god-man characteristics.

A Report Intended to Terrorize.
The ten spies who brought back to the Israelites in the wilderness a false report on the land of Canaan declared: “All the people whom we saw in the midst of it are men of extraordinary size. And there we saw the Nephilim, the sons of Anak, who are from the Nephilim; so that we became in our own eyes like grasshoppers, and the same way we became in their eyes.” No doubt there were some large men in Canaan, as other scriptures show, but never except in this “bad report,” which was carefully couched in language designed to strike terror and cause panic among the Israelites, are they called Nephilim.—Nu 13:31-33; 14:36, 37.

source Jehovahs Witnesses

Originally posted by menace71
Indeed I knew about the Nephilm. This does not however prove that Jesus was the arch angel Micheal. There is some debate on who or what they were. I tend to believe they were angelic beings. Also they were called the Sons of God. Similar language is used in the book of Job. In Job the Sons of God is used to speak of the host and Satan came amongst them also. Oh but you said that in your post above.



Manny

whatever.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
whatever.

Ok....If you say so.

Originally posted by menace71
You know you never answer a question straight. I would run you off my door step just for that reason alone.




Manny

you know, if i was subject to the accusation on a doorstep that i am here, i would leap over the fence, bid the householder a hearty goodbye, long life and prosperity and find someone that was really interested in truth.