Salvation

Originally posted by checkbaiter
What you are not understanding is that you are talking about two different times in history. Things change. For example...
In the gospels, holy spirit was still conditional. That is, salvation could be lost because Christ had not yet fully accomplished His ministry. Now, in the New Testament after Christ assended, the holy spirit was given on the day of ...[text shortened]... ved it from man, nor was I taught it, but it came through the revelation of Jesus Christ.
(NKJ)

What did I tell you, Rajk999? So what Jesus said in Matthew 25 about Judgment Day at the end of time only applied for the few months of his ministry. 🙄

Originally posted by no1marauder
What did I tell you, Rajk999? So what Jesus said in Matthew 25 about Judgment Day at the end of time only applied for the few months of his ministry. 🙄

You seem to have very little understanding of scripture. You should read the whole bible instead of just the gospels.

Originally posted by checkbaiter
You seem to have very little understanding of scripture. You should read the whole bible instead of just the gospels.

I understand that people like you don't believe in Christ's explicit words and then have the effrontery to call yourself "Christians".

Originally posted by checkbaiter
What you are not understanding is that you are talking about two different times in history. Things change. For example...12 For I neither received it from man, nor was I taught it, but it came through the revelation of Jesus Christ.
(NKJ)

While i respect your interpretation I have to say that it clashes and makes amockery of the teachings of Christ and the disciples. I have to agree with No1 ... how can the validity of Jesus's ministry be reduced to a so short a period ??

There are so many contradictions of your interpretation with Christ, that I dont know where tostart. How can Christ even claim that ".... my words will not pass away" ?

Originally posted by Rajk999
Blindfaith .. do you mind explaining this in a bit more detail ? Thanks.

Alot of those that post on The Spirituality thread, pick and choose from THE WORD OF GOD. They find one of two verses of Scripture to turn what CHRIST says to fit their Ungodliness.
For example MATTHEW 25: 31-46.......
There are those that read verses 34-36 is all you need to gain everlasting life. Yet the message that CHRIST was giving began at MATTHEW 24:1. Where CHRIST was letting HIS followers know The Price of believing and following HIM. HE was also giving examples of those that Believed that they were Followers, but were not. Those that have not the faith to follow the Whole Word.
They follow part of THE WORD OF GOD. The examples that HE gives in this talk, show that; those who have the faith to use all of their ability will be rewarded. Those that donot use their faith to the fullest, will go into everlasting damnation.
So what been happening here is.... that there are those that, pick and choose what they believe.

Originally posted by checkbaiter
What you are not understanding is that you are talking about two different times in history. Things change. For example...
In the gospels, holy spirit was still conditional. That is, salvation could be lost because Christ had not yet fully accomplished His ministry. Now, in the New Testament after Christ assended, the holy spirit was given on the day of ...[text shortened]... ved it from man, nor was I taught it, but it came through the revelation of Jesus Christ.
(NKJ)

This is when we get into that arguement "Once Saved always Saved."
If you just use The WORDS OF CHRIST, you can disprove that arguement.

Originally posted by blindfaith101
This is when we get into that arguement "Once Saved always Saved."
If you just use The WORDS OF CHRIST, you can disprove that arguement.

Do you think that a saved person can become unsaved, and then must get saved again in order to get to heaven? Isn't that just silly?

Question for the Greek scholars: does the verb 'believe' as used in John 3:16 have a perfect or progressive aspect?

Originally posted by blindfaith101
Alot of those that post on The Spirituality thread, pick and choose from THE WORD OF GOD. They find one of two ...........So what been happening here is.... that there are those that, pick and choose what they believe.

Thanks. I agree that its dangerous to take words out of context and to pick and choose sections that suit your style. I also accept that there is a several requirements for salvation - belief, baptism, accepting Christ and good works.

Now what my original contention is the apparent way current Christian religions downplay and often ignore Matt 25 and other passages like it. Also note that Matt 25 is not an isolated comment. Several people ask Christ about eternal life and it was along the same lines. Even in the time of Paul he advocated the sharing of all wealth and giving generously.

If we assume that Christ's mission was to save mankind ie die and preach. Why do so many assume that they need to re-interpret what he said. If it was Christs intention that we know to study and practice the entire Bible (Old Testatment at that time) I guess he would have said so very clearly .. don't you think so ?

Originally posted by no1marauder
What did I tell you, Rajk999? So what Jesus said in Matthew 25 about Judgment Day at the end of time only applied for the few months of his ministry. 🙄

What JESUS said was for all events that lead up to RELELATIONS 22:21

Originally posted by no1marauder
I understand that people like you don't believe in Christ's explicit words and then have the effrontery to call yourself "Christians".

If all So-called Christians Believed All that JESUS said, and Focased on what HE said, there be nothing to dispute.

Originally posted by Rajk999
While i respect your interpretation I have to say that it clashes and makes amockery of the teachings of Christ and the disciples. I have to agree with No1 ... how can the validity of Jesus's ministry be reduced to a so short a period ??

There are so many contradictions of your interpretation with Christ, that I dont know where tostart. How can Christ even claim that ".... my words will not pass away" ?

The whole subject of the bible from Genesis 3:15 to Revelation 22:21 is Jesus Christ.
Matt 5:18
18 "For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled.
(NKJ)

Rom 10:4
4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.
(NKJ)
Are you saying you believe the gospels but not the Epistles? If so, then our discussion ends here. If you believe the whole bible to be God breathed, then you have to understand all, not just the gospels. Every book is important, including the gospels. But this does not make four books relevant and the rest irevelant.

Originally posted by blindfaith101
Alot of those that post on The Spirituality thread, pick and choose from THE WORD OF GOD. They find one of two verses of Scripture to turn what CHRIST says to fit their Ungodliness.
For example MATTHEW 25: 31-46.......
There are those that read verses 34-36 is all you need to gain everlasting life. Yet the message that CHRIST was giving began at MATT ...[text shortened]... So what been happening here is.... that there are those that, pick and choose what they believe.

This is, again, the absurd claim that Jesus' discussion of Judgment Day is a parable. The parables in Matthew 25; that of the foolish bridesmaids and the ungrateful servant are A) Clearly identified as such; and B) Clearly impart lessons regarding Judgment Day. The first is that you don't know when you might die and thus your obligation to do good can't wait. The second is even more direcly appropriate: the servant who increased the value of what he has received is rewarded; the one who does nothing is punished. The message is pretty clear.

There is none of the language used in parables in Matthew 25:31-46; no "it is like" or the rest. Christ's words regarding Judgment Day are specific and explicit; the ONLY PLACE IN SCRIPTURE where Judgment Day is specifically described. To try to label it as a parable because it clashes with ideas expressed by Paul and others, borders on blasphemy.

Originally posted by blindfaith101
If all So-called Christians Believed All that JESUS said, and Focased on what HE said, there be nothing to dispute.

Why don't you try it, BF101 rather than insisting his explicit description of Judgment Day and the requirements for salvation is a parable?

Originally posted by DoctorScribbles
Do you think that a saved person can become unsaved, and then must get saved again in order to get to heaven? Isn't that just silly?

Question for the Greek scholars: does the verb 'believe' as used in John 3:16 have a perfect or progressive aspect?

There are many that come to CHRIST. They recieve the Gifts of THE HOLY SPIRIT. They Preach, Sing, Dance, and Live for Christ. Then for what ever reason, they turn back into the World, back into a world of sin. Are they still Saved? No.
Did they not throw their Salvation away? As long as they are alive, they can Repent, and turn from their sin. But if they die in their sin, Are they still saved? No.
There are many Christians, that go to Church, but as soon as service is over. They are back in the world sinning. If die before they repent are they going to heaven? No.
What most Sinners and Backsliders donot want to hear is. That GOD declears that we must live Holy. JESUS CHRIST, spoke about living Holy. All Christians are bound by THE WORD OF GOD to live Holy.

Originally posted by checkbaiter
The whole subject of the bible from Genesis 3:15 to Revelation 22:21 is Jesus Christ.
Matt 5:18
18 "For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle[b] will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled.
(NKJ)

Rom 10:4
4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believe ...[text shortened]... rtant, including the gospels. But this does not make four books relevant and the rest irevelant.[/b]

It's rather absurd for you to quote Matthew 5:18 right after a post where you said that Jesus' words in Matthew 25 were no longer applicable after his ascension. The main focus of a true "Christian" would have to be on the actual words of Christ.