02 Mar 05
Originally posted by krazykenWow, something intelligent for a change. Well done.
Thanks to Darfius and Starrman for demonstrating what religion without spirituality is like, a bunch of petty debate 😉
for a religion to be effective, it needs to incorporate spirituality, communicating with god on a personal level. To get truth requires only a prayer. Books are not needed, but may help spread knowledge that others have gained in their ...[text shortened]... at works for a desert nomad society, may not be right for a suburban information based society.
02 Mar 05
Originally posted by DarfiusDarfius, why are you so angry. I made a statement that reflected where I come from. I didn't call anybody any names, yet your replies are often in the spirit of picking a fight or denegrating someone. I cannot be responsible as to how others respond to you, but I felt that nothing I said deserved your anger.
Sprituality is for those who fear Heaven. Religion is for those who aspire to go there.
02 Mar 05
Originally posted by kirksey957I'm sorry I came off as angry, dear kirk. I am merely stating my opinion. I would let you know if I was angry. It's extremely difficult to get me in such a state, though, so please do not worry.
Darfius, why are you so angry. I made a statement that reflected where I come from. I didn't call anybody any names, yet your replies are often in the spirit of picking a fight or denegrating someone. I cannot be responsible as to how others respond to you, but I felt that nothing I said deserved your anger.
03 Mar 05
Originally posted by ivanhoeNo, I wouldn't say higher "intellectual status." I would simply say that for me, I am more comfortable with the concept of "spiritual" but have not always been that way. It is simply an evolution of my faith. The reason I am more comfortable with spiritual is that the people I get support, friendship from subscribe to an incarnational theology where God might be manifested in a variety of ways and experiences that may or may not include the Bible. And in my work I come across many people who would be more comfortable with strict literal interpretation of the Bible as God's only word. Many of these people I experience as bitter and unhappy and ill at peace.
* Bump* ...... for Kirk of course ...
03 Mar 05
Originally posted by ivanhoeKirk, do you believe that being "spiritual" has a higher intellectual status than being "religious" ?
Kirk, do you believe that being "spiritual" has a higher intellectual status than being "religious" ?
Hi Ivanhoe.
I’m not Kirk, but I’ll throw my answer out: If by religion you mean a particular expression of spirituality, then I’d say that spirituality has a higher general status because it crosses over religious barriers. Maybe we ought to try to define spiritual, however.
Interestingly, RBHill’s argument, which I think has a long pedigree, is that Christianity represents a Christ-centered spirituality (acceptance of Jesus as the Christ) that cuts across the religious lines of different doctrines and denominations (if I’m interpreting him correctly).
03 Mar 05
Originally posted by kirksey957Kirk: " ... that the people I get support, friendship from subscribe to an incarnational theology where God might be manifested in a variety of ways and experiences that may or may not include the Bible."
No, I wouldn't say higher "intellectual status." I would simply say that for me, I am more comfortable with the concept of "spiritual" but have not always been that way. It is simply an evolution of my faith. The reason I am more comfortable with spiritual is that the people I get support, friendship from subscribe to an incarnational theology w ...[text shortened]... as God's only word. Many of these people I experience as bitter and unhappy and ill at peace.
..... incarnational theology ...... where God might be manifested in a variety of ways and experiences ........
Could you be more specific about this please ? Manifested in which ways and which experiences ?
03 Mar 05
Originally posted by vistesd
[b]Kirk, do you believe that being "spiritual" has a higher intellectual status than being "religious" ?
Hi Ivanhoe.
I’m not Kirk, but I’ll throw my answer out: If by religion you mean a particular expression of spirituality, then I’d say that spirituality has a higher general status because it crosses over religious barriers. Maybe we ...[text shortened]... religious lines of different doctrines and denominations (if I’m interpreting him correctly).
[/b]
..... mmmmh. What I'm trying to find out is whether being "spiritual" is somehow at a higher level or rather possesses a higher status, than being "religious".
03 Mar 05
Ivanhoe, let me give another example from my personal life. I very much like classical music. So as I am typing this I am listening to Bach's Sheep May Safely Graze. When I listen, excuse me, experience , this music, I am filled with peace and awe that may be beyond my words to explain. You may have had a similar experience. I am simply open to this as a gift.
03 Mar 05
Originally posted by ivanhoeFrom your tradition (Roman Catholic) what would you say? There is a great tradition of mysticism in the Catholic church.
..... mmmmh. What I'm trying to find out is whether being "spiritual" is somehow at a higher level or rather possesses a higher status, than being "religious".
03 Mar 05
1 edit
Originally posted by ivanhoeI would say only in the sense that there can be people who are spiritual without having a particular religious expression that they adhere to, while some people can bind themselves (religare) to a religious expression without having a real spiritual sense. I would suspect that the first is relatively rare, while the second seems to be quite common. More common may be people who find spirit within and through their religion; some of those can "transcend" the religion (without necessarily leaving it behind as an outward expression--Thomas Merton comes to mind here), and some cannot.
..... mmmmh. What I'm trying to find out is whether being "spiritual" is somehow at a higher level or rather possesses a higher status, than being "religious".