The Agenda

@SecondSon

So what you're saying is is that the Word of God is a straw man argument.

Now we're getting somewhere. 🙄

With Rajk999 I'm getting nowhere at warp speed.

Equally mysterious is why I even engage with him anymore. I guess I assume some other readers may be helped.

@secondson said
Nobody is saying faith saves.

Your thinking process is incredibly convoluted.

When will it sink into your head? God saves. Jesus died to save sinners. Through faith we believe God, and then God saves.

Jesus said you must be born again or you won't see the kingdom of God.

You cannot do anything to born yourself again. It is the sovereign act of God that causes ...[text shortened]... an't bring yourself to believe that through faith you can receive the free gift of everlasting life.

Show me where Jesus Christ said all that I will believe it.
What you say is like the wind blowing ... means nothing to me.

@sonship said

I elaborated faithfully on Galatians 5:19-21; First Cor. 6:9-11; Eph. 5:3-5 multiple times over the years.

You elaborated nonsensically.

No inheritance means just that.
Evil Christians will be destroyed, means just that.

You are a bible twister.

@secondson said
You had better take a closer look at Romans 3:21,22.

But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;
Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

"Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ
unto al ...[text shortened]... of God".

The righteousness of God was attained for man by Jesus on the cross. It's all about Him.

The constant failing of your interpretation of Paul is not reading all of it. One such failing I already identified.

- Paul said Christians are saved by grace through faith. You take that to mean that once they have faith then they have eternal life. But then you ignore all the wiritngs of Paul which state that failure to do good works and to live righteously means there is no inheritance in the Kingdom of God. Your partial reading of Paul has caused your interpretation to be flawed.

Here is another. The word believe can be interpreted to mean a profession of faith with the mouth. That however is condemned in the bible. Condemned by Jesus and all the Apostles. Belief has a special meaning which I already commented on. But you rather hold on to a belief with the mouth.

Your doctrine does not take into consideration all that Paul preached.

@rajk999 said
Show me where Jesus Christ said all that I will believe it.
What you say is like the wind blowing ... means nothing to me.

Luke 19:10
For the Son of Man came to seek and to save the lost.”

1 Timothy 1:15
The saying is trustworthy and deserving of full acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am the foremost.

John 3:3
Jesus answered him, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God.”

@kellyjay said
Luke 19:10
For the Son of Man came to seek and to save the lost.”

1 Timothy 1:15
The saying is trustworthy and deserving of full acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am the foremost.

John 3:3
Jesus answered him, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God.”

There are two aspects to eternal life. One is the death and resurrection of Christ which Jesus said nothing about to those to whom he preached. Nobody is required to know or to believe it, but Jesus did His part. This is the grace of God in sending His Son to die for the sins of the world.

The next part is what everyone should be concerned about. It is the duty of everyone interested in eternal life to follow the commandments, because failure to keep the commandments there is no eternal life.

Jesus said this and much more
Blessed are the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
Blessed are they that mourn: for they shall be comforted.
Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.
Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled.
Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy.
Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.
Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God.
(Matthew 5:3-9 KJV)

But like shortsighted fools, the Christian churches of today has focused on what Jesus did, proclaiming that all you need to to is to believe in Christ and believe in His resurrection etc. Good works and righteousness is not required.

Matt 25 has the answer to who gets eternal life and who gets cast out.

I rest my case.

@rajk999 said
There are two aspects to eternal life. One is the death and resurrection of Christ which Jesus said nothing about to those to whom he preached. Nobody is required to know or to believe it, but Jesus did His part. This is the grace of God in sending His Son to die for the sins of the world.

The next part is what everyone should be concerned about. It is the duty of everyon ...[text shortened]... quired.

Matt 25 has the answer to who gets eternal life and who gets cast out.

I rest my case.

You're first paragraph is interesting, but how do you reconcile your statement of "not required to believe" with John 3:16?

@chaney3 said
You're first paragraph is interesting, but how do you reconcile your statement of "not required to believe" with John 3:16?

He ignores it.

@rajk999 said
There are two aspects to eternal life. One is the death and resurrection of Christ which Jesus said nothing about to those to whom he preached. Nobody is required to know or to believe it, but Jesus did His part. This is the grace of God in sending His Son to die for the sins of the world.

The next part is what everyone should be concerned about. It is the duty of everyon ...[text shortened]... quired.

Matt 25 has the answer to who gets eternal life and who gets cast out.

I rest my case.

You asked for scripture and it was provided, and now you twist scripture to deny the written Word. Jesus said the work of God is to believe on Him, your twisting of scripture is right out of Hell. You will have no excuse when you stand before God in your sins, after you failed to work your way into God's grace.


John 6:27-29 English Standard Version (ESV)
Do not work for the food that perishes, but for the food that endures to eternal life, which the Son of Man will give to you. For on him God the Father has set his seal.” Then they said to him, “What must we do, to be doing the works of God?” Jesus answered them, “This is the work of God, that you believe in him whom he has sent.”

John 3
Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.

@kellyjay said
He ignores it.

Yes, it would appear he does.
You've also provided further scripture in your other post that makes it clear "belief" seems to be required.

@chaney3 said
You're first paragraph is interesting, but how do you reconcile your statement of "not required to believe" with John 3:16?

Here is the passage
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. (John 3:16 KJV)

Here is an example of some people who believed, they called him Lord, they did miracles and cast out devils therefore they had the Holy Spirit.

Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. (Matthew 7:21-23 KJV)

Faithful, believers, with the Holy Spirit, cast out. Figure that out.

Christians want you to think that all you have to do is profess your faith and boom ... eternal life. Well many of them will be in for a shock.

@rajk999 said
Here is the passage
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. (John 3:16 KJV)

Here is an example of some people who believed, they called him Lord, they did miracles and cast out devils therefore they had the Holy Spirit.

[i]Not every one that saith unto me, Lord ...[text shortened]... ve to do is profess your faith and boom ... eternal life. Well many of them will be in for a shock.

You cannot simply dismiss the "belief" requirement, Jesus said it's a requirement.

This doesn't negate good works, they go hand in hand.

@rajk999 said
Here is the passage
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. (John 3:16 KJV)

Here is an example of some people who believed, they called him Lord, they did miracles and cast out devils therefore they had the Holy Spirit.

[i]Not every one that saith unto me, Lord ...[text shortened]... ve to do is profess your faith and boom ... eternal life. Well many of them will be in for a shock.

Again you don't know what your talking about! Jesus told them depart from Him why? Because He didn't know them, He didn't deny the works they claimed they did and those works did nothing for them to bring them into God's Kingdom! Jesus did a lot of those works, you calling Jesus evil? The reason they were cast out was clear Jesus was not wishy washy on why they were being cast out, He did not know them. Nothing you say here changes the text you were given earlier, Jesus says we must believe on Him, but you say no? Who are you again that your word is more important than Jesus?

@chaney3 said
You cannot simply dismiss the "belief" requirement, Jesus said it's a requirement.

This doesn't negate good works, they go hand in hand.

I never dismissed belief. I said that belief has a special meaning that is not just a profession of faith with the mouth.

@rajk999 said
I never dismissed belief. I said that belief has a special meaning that is not just a profession of faith with the mouth.

Can an Atheist at death be saved due to their works?