The Bible is a mess!

Originally posted by ianellis
Your confusion lies in your inability to think laterally 🙂

Maybe.
Could you learned chaps clarify for me - who was Joseph's father? Was it Jacob or Heli?
😀

Jacob:

Matthew 1:16
and Jacob was the father of Joseph, the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ.


Heli:

Luke 3:23
Jesus, when he began his ministry, was about thirty years of age, being the son (as was supposed) of Joseph, the son of Heli


Think laterally about that one & get back to me!

Originally posted by Squelchbelch
I mean, base your life on a political tool that can't even decide on how its principal baddie dies...

"And he cast down the pieces of silver into the temple and departed, and went out and hanged himself." (Matt. 27:5)

Or...

"And falling headlong, he burst asunder in the midst, and all of his bowels gushed out." (Acts 1:18)

Hmmmmm

😉

Who cares the point is he killed himself.

Originally posted by RBHILL
Who cares the point is he killed himself.

No.
The point is that the Bible is so riddled with internal strife & contradictions that who can say which parts (if any) can be trusted?

Originally posted by Squelchbelch
No.
The point is that the Bible is so riddled with internal strife & contradictions that who can say which parts (if any) can be trusted?

Outside of a bit of 700 BCE geography and insight into the early xian movement, why would anyone care? Nearly all of it is oral tradition and moralistic ramblings.

Originally posted by telerion
Outside of a bit of 700 BCE geography and insight into the early xian movement, why would anyone care? Nearly all of it is oral tradition and moralistic ramblings.

So, if you are a Christian, from where do you get your teachings?

Originally posted by Squelchbelch
So, if you are a Christian, from where do you get your teachings?

I love this Question.

Originally posted by Squelchbelch
So, if you are a Christian, from where do you get your teachings?

Invariably another person, usually a clergyman. Kids of xian parents also typically get their teachings from their parents and their Sunday school teachers.

Very few xians actually read the Bible and form their own opinion. They follow study guides and Bible footnotes to interpret passages to be consistent with what they have been taught already.

Originally posted by whodey
You may find contradictions but I do not as I have addressed the supposide contradictions that has been claimed in the Bible. I think you will agree that it is far easier to find contradictions in writings that you are either unfamiliar with or fundamentally disagree with in general. In fact, contradictions are often manufactured in such instances.

As fa uscript in which to refer to in order to prove that the Bible of today has been tampered with.

One last Question to you:

Here Jesus say he didn't come to destroy the Law:

Math:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.



Here Paul Destroy the law:

Hebrews: 16 Who is made, not after the law of a carnal commandment, but after the power of an endless life.

17 For he testifieth, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.
Psa 110:4

18 For there is verily a disannulling of the commandment going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof.

19 For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did; by the which we draw nigh unto God.

Which one should I follow?

Which one of them do you follow?

Originally posted by Squelchbelch
No.
The point is that the Bible is so riddled with internal strife & contradictions that who can say which parts (if any) can be trusted?

The Bible also says iy is to shame the wise.

Originally posted by ahosyney
One last Question to you:

Here Jesus say he didn't come to destroy the Law:

[b]Math:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.



Here Paul Destroy the law:

Hebrews: 16 Who is made, not after the law of a carnal commandment, but after the power of an endless life.

17 Fo ...[text shortened]... h we draw nigh unto God.

Which one should I follow?

Which one of them do you follow?[/b]

It will try to explain it to you. Deuteronomy 8:1 says, "All the commandments I enjoin on you today you must keep and observe so that you may live and increase in numbers and enter into the land that God has promised.......Learn from this that the Lord your God was training you as a man trains his child, and keep the commandments of the Lord your God, and so follow his ways and reverence him."

So let me ask you, does God expect us to follow the letter of the law 100%? Do we not all break the law? Do we not all sin? Yes we do. If we then break the smallest commandment of the law, are we then not transgressors of the law? How then can we be justified by the law if we have trangressed the law only one time? The law represents the holiness of God. Are we perfect and holy like God? No, therefore we transgress the law at times. It then becomes evident that the law is nothing more than a source of condemnation for us because we are all guilty of violating it.

How then can man be justified once he has broken the law? It says in Deuteronomy that the law was nothing more than an attempt to train us in the ways of God and to expose us to his standards that we are unable to live up to 100%. The answer is that love is the real commandment that we are to obey. This is what the original law was attempting to show us. The number one commandment in the Bible is to love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and to love your neighbor as yourself is it not? If you do this, you will keep all the commandments of God without even trying. For example, all of the laws of the ten commandments have an this element of love mixed into them. Examples that are easy to see are commandments not to kill, or bear false witness, or steal. How could you do such things if you had love in your heart. However, other commandments such as honoring the sabbath are not as easy to see. In fact, Christ was accused of breaking the Sabbath as he healed people on the Sabbath. His response was if you saw your beast of burden fall into a pit, would you not rescue him on the Sabbath? After all, it is emergent and is done to save those that need saving who you care for. In Mark 2:27 Christ says that the Sabbath was made for man and not the other way around. Unfortunatly men became slaves to the concept of keeping the Sabbath for the mere sake of adhering to the letter of the law rather than the Sabbath freeing them from work 24/7 even if it ment violating the most important commandment which is to love God and his creation. The concept of a Sabbath was very revolutionary for its time. Men often slaved 24/7 in the ancient world without break or rest. Their lives were full of drudgery with no time for reflection. This was not what God had intended. The Sabbath challenged this notion and I dare say is why we today have a period of rest known as the weekend. So as we see we are confronted with the letter of the law as Christ was confronted with breaking the Sabbath and the spirit of the law and the reasoning for us having the law to begin with. This is why Christ is the fulfillment of the law. No man has greater love than to lay down his life for his friends. Christ is the fulfillment of the love message which is the spirit of every law given in the Old Testament. Thus we were given the law as mere children by being told to obey the letter of the law for the sake of the law in the hopes of one day maturing into the realization that obeying the letter of the law is not the goal, rather, the goal is to love God and want to please him as well as love those whom he has created.

John 3:16 says, "For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son that whosoever believes on him should not perish but have everlasting life."

Love is the completion or fulfillment of the law of God.

Originally posted by whodey
It will try to explain it to you. Deuteronomy 8:1 says, "All the commandments I enjoin on you today you must keep and observe so that you may live and increase in numbers and enter into the land that God has promised.......Learn from this that the Lord your God was training you as a man trains his child, and keep the commandments of the Lord your God, and so ...[text shortened]... rish but have everlasting life."

Love is the completion or fulfillment of the law of God.

I read all what you said, but I didn't find the answer of my question. Do you follow the Christ, and follow the law. Or do you follow Paul and don't follow the law?

Originally posted by Squelchbelch
So, if you are a Christian, from where do you get your teachings?

Pretty much from the same place as every other religion: received tradition.

Originally posted by ahosyney
I read all what you said, but I didn't find the answer of my question. Do you follow the Christ, and follow the law. Or do you follow Paul and don't follow the law?

You still don't see what Paul is saying do you? Read 1 Corinthians 13:11 which says, "When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child, but when I became a man, I put away childish things. For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face; now I know in part; but then will I know even as I am known. And now abides faith, hope, love, these three things, but the greatest of these is love." Here Paul is embracing the spirit of the law which is love and not the letter of the law which brings condemnation to those who cannot keep every statute. He no longer cares about the letter of the law just as Christ did not when he went around healing on the Sabbath. Through the love of Christ we obtain grace despite not being able to keep the letter of the law and therefore the law becomes secondary because we are no longer attempting to be justified by it. Does this mean that we are therefore free to transgress the law? No, rather, Christ says that if we love him we will try to do what we know pleases him which is adhering to the law of love. As I said before, if our focus is to love God and our neighbor we will not transgress the law. Our focus then becomes the love of Christ and his grace rather than mindless ritualistic adherance to the letter of the law in which our heart is not engaged.

Originally posted by ahosyney
No, how can I tell it is inspired by GOD if I don't know who give it to me. What if he was lying?

What's riding on your need to believe it as inspired?

Originally posted by whodey
If it is not inspired by God it is a man who wrote it and, therefore, it would matter little as to who that man was that wrote it because it would not be from God. Likewise, if it is inspired by God it matters little who the author was because man is merely the pen of God. Therefore the only concern is if it is inspired by God, no?

There's some pretty thin-ass reasoning flying around here as to what constitutes inspiration.

Can you really isolate the source of any inspiration? Do you think that the ancients were any better equipped to do so?

The concern over whether a text is or is not inspired by God is ultimately futile. There's no final answer to be had.