The Heart

Originally posted by @thinkofone
Explain exactly how my beliefs as to whether or not Jesus was God is relevant to whether or not it is not presumptuous for anyone to think that they are in a position to judge themselves as being saved given that Jesus said that He will judge.

You seem to think that it is not presumptuous. Show that it is not presumptuous or admit that it is.

<<Explain exactly how my beliefs as to whether or not Jesus was God...>>

You’re misrepresenting what I said. I didn’t say whether or not you believe Jesus was God, I said whether or not you believe Jesus was only a man (as I think you have stated in the past - correct me if I’m wrong.)

Originally posted by @thinkofone
I understand the question. But the fact remains that it's not relevant to the issue that we're discussing. The issue at hand is about HIS beliefs. Not mine.

It appears you’re trying to argue from a position you don’t believe in. It’s not honest.

You refuse to say if you’re an atheist. And now you’re refusing to confirm you think Jesus was just a man.

Just answer the latter and I’ll be happy to address your post.

Do you believe Jesus was just a man?

Originally posted by @romans1009
<<Explain exactly how my beliefs as to whether or not Jesus was God...>>

You’re misrepresenting what I said. I didn’t say whether or not you believe Jesus was God, I said whether or not you believe Jesus was only a man (as I think you have stated in the past - correct me if I’m wrong.)

Now you're just picking nits as way to continue to evade the issue

Here. I'll rephrase:

Explain exactly how my belief as to whether or not Jesus was [only a man] is relevant to whether or not it is not presumptuous for anyone to think that they are in a position to judge themselves as being saved given that Jesus said that He will judge.

You seem to think that it is not presumptuous. Show that it is not presumptuous or admit that it is.

Originally posted by @thinkofone
Now you're just picking nits as way to continue to evade the issue

Here. I'll rephrase:

Explain exactly how my belief as to whether or not Jesus was [only a man] is relevant to whether or not it is not presumptuous for anyone to think that they are in a position to judge themselves as being saved given that Jesus said that He will judge.

Y ...[text shortened]... think that it is not presumptuous. Show that it is not presumptuous or admit that it is.

<<Now you're just picking nits as way to continue to evade the issue>>

It’s not picking nits at all. There are some who believe Jesus was neither a man nor God in the flesh but was an angel.

If Jesus were just a man, how does he have the authority to judge anyone?

Originally posted by @romans1009
<<Now you're just picking nits as way to continue to evade the issue>>

It’s not picking nits at all. There are some who believe Jesus was neither a man nor God in the flesh but was an angel.

If Jesus were just a man, how does he have the authority to judge anyone?

Explain exactly how my belief as to whether or not Jesus was [only a man] is relevant to whether or not it is not presumptuous for anyone to think that they are in a position to judge themselves as being saved given that Jesus said that He will judge.

You seem to think that it is not presumptuous. Show that it is not presumptuous or admit that it is.

Originally posted by @thinkofone
Explain exactly how my belief as to whether or not Jesus was [only a man] is relevant to whether or not it is not presumptuous for anyone to think that they are in a position to judge themselves as being saved given that Jesus said that He will judge.

You seem to think that it is not presumptuous. Show that it is not presumptuous or admit that it is.

If Jesus were just a man, how does he have the authority to judge anyone?

Originally posted by @romans1009
If Jesus were just a man, how does he have the authority to judge anyone?

And Romans' evasion continues...

This is how he has earned his reputation as one of the most dishonest posters on this forum.

He asks questions that are not relevant to the issue at hand to avoid addressing the issue. Then accuses the person of not answering questions. It's dishonest.

Originally posted by @thinkofone
And Romans' evasion continues...

This is how he has earned his reputation as one of the most dishonest posters on this forum.

He asks questions that are not relevant to the issue at hand to avoid addressing the issue. Then accuses the person of not answering questions. It's dishonest.

It’s absolutely relevant. You claim Jesus will judge everyone in the afterlife and determine their salvation, but if he was only a man, as I believe you’ve said in the past, by what authority is he doing that?

Just another example of another flaw in your “Jesus was only a man” doctrine.

I see you’re now resorting to personal attacks to divert attention from your refusal to answer yet another question. Not surprising - it’s how you operate. Just disappointing.

Originally posted by @romans1009
The old saying in kindergarten is, You always tease the one you love.

The adult version is, The opposite of love isn’t hate. It’s indifference.

Suzy really must love me!

Originally posted by @eladar
Do you know what judge nothing means?

Do you think Paul was simply displaying human error when he wrote judge nothing?

In case you missed it.

Originally posted by @romans1009
It’s absolutely relevant. You claim Jesus will judge everyone in the afterlife and determine their salvation, but if he was only a man, as I believe you’ve said in the past, by what authority is he doing that?

Just another example of another flaw in your “Jesus was only a man” doctrine.

I see you’re now resorting to personal attacks to divert atten ...[text shortened]... fusal to answer yet another question. Not surprising - it’s how you operate. Just disappointing.

You continue to evade the issue:

I know. And I'm saying that it seems presumptuous for any of them think that they are in a position to judge themselves as being saved.

Especially with Jesus saying that He will judge. Evidently you believe that individuals are able to judge themselves as well as Jesus is able.

Plus I've come across quite a few - both Christian and non-Christian alike - whose self-image does not line up with reality.

**Show how it is not presumptuous for anyone to think that they are in a position to judge themselves as being saved given that Jesus said that He will judge.**

My beliefs as to whether or not Jesus was [only a man] is not relevant to this issue.

This is what you do. You ask questions that are not relevant to the issue at hand to avoid addressing the issue. Then you accuse the person of not answering questions. It's dishonest.

Originally posted by @thinkofone
You continue to evade the issue:
[quote]I know. And I'm saying that it seems presumptuous for any of them think that they are in a position to judge themselves as being saved.

Especially with Jesus saying that He will judge. Evidently you believe that individuals are able to judge themselves as well as Jesus is able.

Plus I've come across quite ...[text shortened]... oid addressing the issue. Then you accuse the person of not answering questions. It's dishonest.

We’ve already gone over this and we can add “Do you think Jesus was only a man?” to the literally dozens of questions you refuse to answer.

Unlike you, I’ll answer your question even though your “Jesus was just a man” position, which I believe you’ve stated in the past, renders it nonsensical because if Jesus were just a man, He has no authority to judge anything (and Jesus saying He has that authority, if He were only a man, doesn’t make it so.)

Judging all things, to me, means judging all decisions and actions - in other words, judging if they were good or bad. If you drove from Rhode Island to New York on Tuesday, Jesus doesn’t “judge” whether you did that. He can judge whether that was a good decision or action but not invalidate the fact you did it.

Your apparent belief (who knows what you believe) that Jesus judges whether one is saved is in direct contradiction to Romans 8:16 and numerous other verses in the Bible, and the Bible makes no mention of such a judgment taking place.

Neither the Judgment Seat of Christ nor the Great White Throne Judgment, which I believe are the only two post-death judgments mentioned in the Bible, is to determine salvation or one’s eternal destination.

Originally posted by @romans1009
We’ve already gone over this and we can add “Do you think Jesus was only a man?” to the literally dozens of questions you refuse to answer.

Unlike you, I’ll answer your question even though your “Jesus was just a man” position, which I believe you’ve stated in the past, renders it nonsensical because if Jesus were just a man, He has no authority to ju ...[text shortened]... -death judgments mentioned in the Bible, is to determine salvation or one’s eternal destination.

As I posted earlier:

John 5
. 21“For just as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, even so the Son also gives life to whom He wishes. 22“For not even the Father judges anyone, but He has given all judgment to the Son, 23so that all will honor the Son even as they honor the Father. He who does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who sent Him.

Jesus clearly states that God has given "all judgment to [Him]" to give "life to whom He wishes".

After I posted the passage above, you went into full evasion mode as usual and haven't come out of it since.
.

Originally posted by @thinkofone
As I posted earlier:

John 5
. 21“For just as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, even so [b]the Son also gives life to whom He wishes. 22“For not even the Father judges anyone, but He has given all judgment to the Son, 23so that all will honor the Son even as they honor the Father. He who does not honor the Son does not honor the Fat ...[text shortened]... the passage above, you went into full evasion mode as usual and haven't come out of it since.
.[/b]

I see you’re back to your psychological projection and personal attacks. Makes me wonder why I even bother conversing with you.

Here’s a good commentary on John 5:21: https://www.biblestudytools.com/commentaries/gills-exposition-of-the-bible/john-5-21.html

And it’s interesting that you neglected the verses that follow it. Here’s the passage in full:

“For as the Father raiseth up the dead, and quickeneth them; even so the Son quickeneth whom he will.

For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son:

That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.

Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”

(Matthew 5:21-24)

Originally posted by @thinkofone
As I posted earlier:

John 5
. 21“For just as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, even so [b]the Son also gives life to whom He wishes. 22“For not even the Father judges anyone, but He has given all judgment to the Son, 23so that all will honor the Son even as they honor the Father. He who does not honor the Son does not honor the Fat ...[text shortened]... the passage above, you went into full evasion mode as usual and haven't come out of it since.
.[/b]

Planning to address any of this?

“Your apparent belief (who knows what you believe) that Jesus judges whether one is saved is in direct contradiction to Romans 8:16 and numerous other verses in the Bible, and the Bible makes no mention of such a judgment taking place.

Neither the Judgment Seat of Christ nor the Great White Throne Judgment, which I believe are the only two post-death judgments mentioned in the Bible, is to determine salvation or one’s eternal destination.”