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20 Nov 16
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Originally posted by karoly aczelI agree that the realm is as vast as the universe itself.
The great variety of human spirituality knows no bounds...imo 🙂
In fact the love of Christ is described as the infinite dimensions of the universe.
That is infinite breadth, infinite length, infinite height, and infinite depth.
" That Christ may make His home in your hearts through faith, that you, being rooted and grounded in love, may be full of strength to apprehend with all the saints what the breadth and length and height and depth are and to know the knowledge-surpassing love of of Christ,
that you may be filled unto all the fullness of God." (See Ephesians 3:17-19)
Paul expresses the love of Christ as the very infinite dimensions of the vast unknown and unknowable size of the whole universe itself.
Is there anything in Zen Buddhism that speaks this way ? I mean as a corporate group of human beings collectively and aggregately needing to be collectively strong to experience so VAST and varied a salvation ?
Maybe I missed it. I don't recall reading anything like a vast corporate salvation of divine love as expansive as the universe. Mostly I read Allen Watts. But most of what I remember was a very individual experience.
Do you remember reading anything like above in Paul's "apprehend with all the saints" ? Or do you recall reading about all the saints being filled unto all the fullness of God ?
Originally posted by sonshipWhy is it then that you are always, always, always talking about [1] what you think about yourself, [2] what you think about supernatural beings, and [3] what you think supernatural beings think about you? Why have you never, ever offered a single scrap of practical spiritual insight to anyone other than people who already believe the same things you do?
I agree that the realm is as vast as the universe itself.
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20 Nov 16
Originally posted by FMF
Why is it then that you are always, always, always talking about [1] what you think about yourself,
I say "I agree" and you ask why I always talk about what I think about myself ?
This is a circular and futile line of criticism.
" Why do you talk about yourself ?
Don't always talk about yourself ! "
lol. I think your best bet is to see if you can get yourself untied from the hog-tie knot Fetchmyjunk has you in.
[2] what you think about supernatural beings, and
Huh?
Now you started a thread on Divination which somewhat touched on the matter of prophecy. So I started one over here on a single chapter in the book of prophecy which I think is a corner study on the end times.
It is very useful to many seekers of safety, security, truth, and enjoyment of God. And it involves God, whom I suppose is what you mean by "supernatural beings".
[3] what you think supernatural beings think about you? Why have you never, ever offered a single scrap of practical spiritual insight to anyone other than people who already believe the same things you do?
Well, here I think you should speak for yourself. Your saying " I NEVER GOT ANYTHING !!"
Okay. Maybe you're saying -
"I NEVER GOT ANYTHING AND NEITHER DID SIX OR SEVEN OTHER GUYS !! "
Okay, Okay, You won that argument.
But that doesn't mean no one ever got any practical spiritual help.
Now if I turned the question around to YOU, you might call "Foul!"
is there a particular thread of which you feel provided much spiritual help to more people? Which thread that you started or even participated in would that be ?
And suppose I did offer some practical spiritual help to you. I don't think you would like that. (I'm understating things this morning)
I suppose the only practical advise I would offer spiritually to FMF this morning is that you're probably wasting your time to read this thread on Revelation 14. You owe it to yourself to do some better things with the fleeting moments you have in this rather brief life.
Don't get offended by this. Aren't you wasting your time talking with a lover of Jesus and the Bible like me ?
Originally posted by sonshipBut why is it that your entire spiritual mind map as you exhibit it here offers no practical spiritual insight to anyone other than people who already share your beliefs? It makes everything you say seem, despite all your vanity and grand pomposity, so small and partisan, and aridly "academic".
But that doesn't mean no one ever got any practical spiritual help.
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20 Nov 16
Maybe I missed something in the poster asking:
Why is it then that you are always, always, always talking about [1] what you think about yourself,
Can anyone see something i missed.
I said that the love of Christ was as vast as the dimensions of the universe according to the Apostle Paul. And a response comes back
Why is it then that you are always, always, always talking about [1] what you think about yourself,
Can someone explain what the connection is suppose to be here ?
Someone other than FMF, preferably.
What was the connection between a vast and extensive Jesus Christ's love and talking about myself "always, always, always" ?
In all the threads I have written over the years was the word "I" mentioned more or was the word "Christ" mentioned more ?
I think I mentioned Jesus and God and the Triune God and Christ probably more than I mentioned myself.
You have about eight years of posts to go back and either confirm or negate this.
Originally posted by sonshipYes I can. You deliberately missed the rest of the sentence I wrote and so are deliberately misrepresenting the content and meaning of what I was asking you. You have quoted a fragment of what I posted and appear to be criticizing it for not including the bits that you deliberately omitted.
Maybe I missed something in the poster asking:
Why is it then that you are always, always, always talking about [1] what you think about yourself,
Can anyone see something i missed.
Originally posted by sonshipYou are being dishonest. You have deleted most of the sentence that you are responding to. You talking about yourself is only one of three things I mentioned. You seem to be criticizing me for only mentioning one things when it is you who has deleted the other two things as if they were not in the sentence you were quoting.
I think I mentioned [b]Jesus and God and the Triune God and Christ probably more than I mentioned myself.[/b]
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20 Nov 16
3 edits
Originally posted by FMF
But why is it that your entire spiritual mind map as you exhibit it here offers no practical spiritual insight to anyone other than people who already share your beliefs?
I do not believe that that is the case.
I believe that non-Christians and unbelievers read some of these posts of Christians and perhaps get some help.
This help may incline them to want to read the Bible for themselves.
This help may incline them to consider their ways in a particular sin that troubles their conscience.
Maybe they confess their sins to God.
If we Christians once were persuaded to humble ourselves and open our hearts to Jesus, others surely can be helped to do so to.
And if ONLY Christians receive spiritual help, that is not a bad thing anyway.
Do I whine because some Zen Buddhist ONLY renders help to another Zen Buddhist?
I don't even complain if ONLY Atheists get help from you.
Come on.
1.) I believe non-believers can and have gotten some help.
2.) I do not feel condemned if only fellow Christians received help.
Does that help ?
You're suppose to say "NO."
Otherwise you're an unbeliever that got some help from a believer.
Perish the thought !
It makes everything you say seem, despite all your vanity and grand pomposity, so small and partisan, and aridly "academic".
You should sometime collect into a list all the ad homs you have written towards Christians here is one thread for others to draw from.
IE. "The Collected Ad Homs of FMF"
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20 Nov 16
Revelation 14 does have some good stuff for those who are undecided and yet may find themselves passing through that time of the great tribulation.
This help is seen in verses 6-7 The Eternal Gospel in the Great Tribulation.
This is not the Gospel of Grace preached in the church age. This is a eternal gospel against Atheism. And more so an eternal gospel against the worship of the coming Antichrist.
Many people do not know that this Gospel, Eternal Gospel of Revelation 14:6-7 is a Gospel concerning the Creator God. Those human beings who respond positively to it will be the humans who are not Christians but who are transferred from this age into the coming millennial kingdom age.
This is a bit controversial. But the evidence is persuasive imo. I may come back to this.
20 Nov 16
Originally posted by sonshipIt's as if you simply do not understand what aspect of your mind map and behaviour you are being confronted about.It makes everything you say seem, despite all your vanity and grand pomposity, so small and partisan, and aridly "academic".
You should sometime collect into a list all the ad homs you have written towards Christians here is one thread for others to draw from.
20 Nov 16
Originally posted by sonshipBUMP. How many people do you think you have converted here? You once claimed that I may have been personally responsible for hundreds of people in this community facing eternal torture after they die as a result of them reading my posts. How is it that you feel able to estimate that I may have done that to "hundreds of people" and yet you have never taken it upon yourself to estimate how many people in this community you have saved from eternal torture?
What's a matter with converting people ?
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20 Nov 16
Originally posted by sonshipAllow to indicate the structure again.
Seven Sections of [b]Revelation 14
1.) Verses 1 - 5 The Firstfruits of the Beleivers before the Great Tribulation.
2.) Verses 6,7 The Eternal Gospel in the Great Tribulation
3.) Verse 8 The Fall of Religious Babylon in the Great Tribulation
4.) Verses 9 - 12 Warning Against the Worship of Antichrist in the Great Tribulation
5.) Verse 13 The Blessing of the Martyrs in the Great Tribulation
6.) Verses 14 - 16 The Harvest of Believers near the End of the Great Tribulation
7.) Verses 17 -20 The Gathering of the Grapes of Wrath (the Evildoers) at the End of the Great Tribulation
Please read and enjoy all of Revelation chapter 14 to master all the facts and prepare for an exposition to help comprehend these visions.[/b]
Now we will zero in on the first section for, as someone proposed, practical spiritual help.
In the first section you see human beings who are not on earth but in heaven. The way they GOT there is by living a heavenly life on earth.
They are standing before God and the Lamb in heaven. The reason they got there is because while they were on earth their HEARTS were already there with God and Christ in heaven.
The practical help here is that God the Father always wanted a people living on earth whose inward being, none-the-less is with God and with His heavenly reign. They follow the Lamb where ever He goes while on earth. The Lamb, the God-man Redeemer Jesus, always followed His Father. And He seeks the spiritual on earth to follow Him (the Lamb) likewise toward the Father, unto the Father, and having the Father as their goal.
It is good to come to God and at least confess that you wish to follow unto His very presence. You want to go to God. This is not a promise that you have the ability to DO so. You do not. You do not apart from from the leading of the Holy Spirit of God.
But it is good for anyone to confess that he or she desires in their heart to come to God, towards God, ie. to draw near to God. To be near rather than far off, is a wonderful petition people can make to God.
Spend the time to open your heart and pour out to God that you desire to draw near to God, to follow Him as the Father of love.
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Originally posted by FMF
BUMP. How many people do you think you have converted here?
I pray for many people. Sometimes I have the joy of seeing people come to the Lord.
I do not expect that these things always have to be witnessed by me.
And I know that some important things take time, even a long time. [edited]
I do not keep statistics.
By the way, I did listen to you about rendering help to unbelievers.
You once claimed that I may have been personally responsible for hundreds of people in this community facing eternal torture after they die as a result of them reading my posts.
Because that conversation was LONG LONG ago, I will not re-study the context, subject matter, and particulars of that argument.
But I am sorry if you took it as a personal offense.
Of course everything you ever wrote about me never failed to leave me with such a peachy and happy feeling about myself, i don't know WHERE I could have possibly gotten the gall to offend you with anything I wrote.
I mean I have sense nothing but love from all your posts for almost a decade now. ... (not).
Anyway, you bring this up from time to time. Whatever I wrote must have bothered you.
I'm sorry. it may have been something I felt needed to be said in RESPONSE to a criticism you had. Occasionally you might conceivably offer a criticism of my posts.
Like for instance, here I am speaking in first person terms. And it might be expected that you will then condemn me for talking about myself always, always, always, always.
This is kind of :"Damned if you do. Damned if you don't".
How is it that you feel able to estimate that I may have done that to "hundreds of people" and yet you have never taken it upon yourself to estimate how many people in this community you have saved from eternal torture?
The "eternal torture" matter again. Always back to what I think really bothers you no end - the "eternal torture" thing.
Do not expect that the Christian proclaimer and teacher of the Gospel will first seek to obtain an OK and approval on methods and procedures of work from an Atheist.
In the "great commission" in Matthew 28 Jesus said He was with the disciples unto the close of the age. And He said they should teach the nations all about what He Himself taught.
My Lord did not say - "But first you have to check your methods and procedures and success rate with Atheists to gain their nod of approval."
I am not waiting for your approval on these things. You are not my Quality Assurance manager.