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@divegeester
How I would respond to Anonymous.
“Witness Less is considered so much more wise than anyone else that if you see something wrong with what is being taught you are obviously not wise enough to understand.”
Well, Anonymous the New Testament says of ALL Christians that God has made Christ wisdom to us. Brother Lee was just one of those ones throughout the church age who took a fuller measure of advantage to partaking of Christ as our wisdom in serving Christ's people.
"But of Him you are in Christ Jesus, who became wisdom to us from God: both righteousness and sanctification and redemption." (Cor. 1:30)
Like brother Paul Witness Lee constantly urged and encourage all Christians to increase in the enjoyment of letting Christ Himself be our wisdom.
”If you bring up criticism they will list Witness Lee/Watchman Nee references all day long but as soon as you require biblical reference or show that the reference they have is out of context they will smile,
I doubt if that has been anyone's experience here with me.
Who has written more Bible references here than me ?
Maybe you gave a silly smile when the plain teaching of the Bible was provided to your question Anonymous.
If you have no written examples of these alleged dodges then we just have to take you anonymous word for it, won't we?
say something about ‘seeing where you are coming from’ and then tell you that they are glad they had that conversation with you. At which point they will go back to believing exactly what they were.”
Mad because you're unconvincing Anonymous ?
Sound like a sore and sour grapes guy whose angry that everybody else doesn't change his mind.
You know Anonymous even Jesus had some disciples who no more wanted to follow Him.
Some of the Internet users who use that site to gather and complain about the local church life followed a woman who became a rallying cry for Internet opposition to the co-workers. Last I heard she quickly went into witchcraft and became a lesbian after deciding the local churches were purveyors of bad teaching.
Did you hear Anonymous how Paul the apostle remarked that "all who are in Asia" left Paul's ministry ?
"This you know, that all who are in Asia turned away from me, of whom are Phygelus and Hermogenes." ( 1 Timothy 1:15)
I bet some of them had sensational grumblings about listening to Paul too.
"X member" is no automatic guarantee of truth.
Even the gospel writer Mark backed off from working with Paul once.
Demas loved the present passing age so much he too decided he couldn't hack being under Paul's leadership anymore.
"For Demas has abandoned me, having loved the present age, and has gone to Thessalonica . . ." (2 Tim. 4:10)
That doesn't prove a servant of God is no good Anonymous.
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On pray reading and calling out names
"I think you should pray with me."
"Okay." *Begin praying internally about giving strength to said person to overcome X or something of the such. The other begins to repeat "Lord Jesus. Aaaaaamen." over and over in a chanting fashion.
Now Anonymous, anybody can make up drama out of their imagination and pass it off as real event. How do we know you're not exaggerating?
Nobody ever insisted that I had to pray-read.
You see Anonymous it is easy to make up a scene?
How do we know you're not exaggerating to push your criticism ?
"I thought you were going to pray with me?"
"I am praying...."
Its a fool's errand to argue with hearsay.
I don't know what actually happened.
"You need to call on the name of the lord."
"I didn't realize I needed to do anything since this isn't a denomination with set rules right?"
Silly stuff.
Please use the search engine at www.ministrybooks.org and FIND ME a sentence from the thousands and thousands there saying something like pray reading was a mandatory requirement for a Christian.
Find me in print a rule that you cannot participate in the church life without the practice of prayreading .
www.localchurches.org should have many local statements of faith from many local churches listed there.
How about the Lord we love exhorts us to call upon His name and declare His doings among the people ?
" . . . call upon His name; make known His deeds among the people" (Psalm 105:1)
" GROAN !! DO I HAVE TO ?? "
"I will take up the cup of salvation and call upon the name of Jehovah" (Psalm 116:14
" OH GROAN, DO I HAVE TO DO THAT ?? "
"And it will be that before they call, I will answer; Even while they are speaking I will hear." (Isaiah 65:24)
" WHEW !! THAT'S GOOD NEWS. I JUST HATE CALLING ON THE LORD ANYWAY" "
See Anonymous? I can make up words to put in your mouth too.
You don't want to call on the Lord Jesus Anonymous?
Its Okay.
Some of us like to call on the name of the Lord Jesus.
The name of Jehovah is a strong tower; The righteous man runs into it and is safe." (Proverbs 18:10)
You have other ways to be safe in the Lord Jesus Anonymous? That's great. Don't let Witness Lee or the local churches stand in your way.
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@medullah
All this talk about Witness Lee is just divegeester, Rajk999 and Ghost doing something to not have to deal with the real matter, Jesus Christ. Its a comfort mechanism, a diversion. They rationalize that to desperately make someone ELSE the main issue so they don't have to think about their denial of Christ as the Lord.
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08 Oct 21
What drives the push-back you get in here is nothing to do with Jesus, nothing to do with God not even to do with religion generally, it’s due to you being a blowhardy, religious copy-pasting foghorn.
I don't accept your rationale.
Over the years it is clear that there are major elements of New Testament that you hold in contempt. The style of delivery may annoy you. But I don't think that is your real issue.
You enlist others to rally around the style, cut and paste issue for support.
Those style matters may rub you the wrong way, Sure.
But underneath, the real problem is the few issues you have with New Testament which you have deep contempt for. The red herrings of style and cut and paste are smoke screen issues.
You're really bothered that people would believe what you cannot believe.
Concerning the Triune God and eternal judgment, for example.
Cult,
cut and paste,
Witness Lee,
self appointed teacher,
Boring posts,
Too long posts,
Nobody reads,
Should be spending time elsewhere,
Should be going door to door,
Space aliens
etc.
etc.
These are just your filler for your real problems with the words of the New Testament and why anyone would believe them when you can't.
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A man trapped in a Christian cult, who cannot cope with dissent, is intellectually dishonest and is obsessed with venerating the human being Witness Lee.
Witness Lee, Witness Lee, Witness Lee . . . . your REAL complaint is with the New Testament - Matthew - Revelation. If I NEVER used another phraseology or jargon employed by Witness Lee you'd still raise red herrings to throw the discussion off track. This you do instead since you fail to make your objections convince some Christians they should also not trust parts of the New Testament.
That’s the “real matter”.
No its not.
I see through your diversions to the real controversy.
Until you acknowledge and accept this, nothing is going to change and you will continue to delude yourself that it’s because you are speaking and “becoming more like Jesus”, or whatever pompous twaddle it is you come out with on occasion.
That's just emotional smoke screen. I have no problem saying I am verbose, longwinded, and heavily influenced by mentors. And there are other things which may annoy you, But more than annoy you you're annoyed that I don't count some of them as being wrong.
Your red herrings have some people here impressed perhaps, to your comfort.
I can see through the emotional jibes to your controversy with Christ's words and His apostles words in the New Testament.
If I bent over backwards to deliver you some amiable style you "approve", your New Testament problems and controversies would STILL come through.
Then you'd just find some new red herrings to use.
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@divegeester
On the ground of pure SCRIPTURE you have never been much able to refute what I have taught here.
So, what do you do? You switch the subject to make a man who died 24 years ago the red herring to conceal your ineptitude with the Bible.
I think you must be really lazy, I can never understand why, instead of hunting for scandal about Witness Lee you don't spend quality time researching the best way to
argue Modalism or the Shema or Annhilationism.
Oh no. Make the center of attention instead Witness Lee gone 24 years ago !
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09 Oct 21
2 edits
@divegeester
Yea. I have taught some people here. Some I taught disagreed.
Some were taught and agreed with some things it seems to me.
Some closed their ears and eyes so they wouldn't BE taught.
And some (whether they learned or not,) they diverted the issue to red herrings by saying "You're just in a cult of personality."
All requests to SHOW me from Scripture where the teaching is wrong for these types only results in them saying "Oh, you are just in a cult of personality."