09 Aug 05
Originally posted by PhlabibitSo, he wanted to be president. That's not the same as being president.
From Lincoln's acceptance speech, 1860.
So here I am running for president. And people ask me, they say, what's this election all about, Abe? I'll tell you what it's about. It's about opportunity....
He ran, and he won. I guess he also liked to say 'Whatever'.
More at http://www.wesclark.com/jw/linc_sp.html
P-
Your same "speech" says: "I want to end slavery as we know it.
Now, that doesn't mean abolishing slavery. I want to mend it, not end it."
Now, from what we're told about "President" Lincoln, he ended slavery. I'm not sure we can trust this speech as being authentic. What else do you have?
09 Aug 05
Originally posted by kingdanwaLeading us into the "infinite regress" will not accomplish your goals. Go talk to Bbarr if you want to discuss epistemology.
So, he wanted to be president. That's not the same as being president.
Your same "speech" says: "I want to end slavery as we know it.
Now, that doesn't mean abolishing slavery. I want to mend it, not end it."
Now, from what we're told about "President" Lincoln, he ended slavery. I'm not sure we can trust this speech as being authentic. What else do you have?
09 Aug 05
Originally posted by rwingettI'm not leading us into infinite regress. I'm merely suggesting that we re-evaluate our data concerning Lincoln's "presidency". I'm not saying that we "can't" know, I'm saying that I'm not convinced by the data that has thus far been presented about "President" Lincoln.
Leading us into the "infinite regress" will not accomplish your goals. Go talk to Bbarr if you want to discuss epistemology.
09 Aug 05
Originally posted by kingdanwaThe lengths some people will go to to hide from avoid a simple debate. Astounding.
To my knowledge, Lincoln never said, "I am President."
Sure he acted like he was, and he had a few followers. But he also had many who didn't attribute presidential authority to him.
If I have have overlooked the many first-hand speeches where Honest Abe said, "I am President," please correct me and accept my apology. But until you present me ...[text shortened]... n he was supposed to have ruled, I don't think we should be hailing him as such a great leader.
10 Aug 05
Originally posted by kingdanwaNonsense. You don't give a fig about Lincoln's Presidency. All you're trying to do is to undercut our basis for claiming any sort of objective knowledge so you can try to weasel in your theism on equal footing. Well, it doesn't work. If you lead us into the infinite regress, then your theistic claims are just as unknowable as any other sort of data. If you undercut the basis for objective knowledge, it doesn't help your case at all.
I'm not leading us into infinite regress. I'm merely suggesting that we re-evaluate our data concerning Lincoln's "presidency". I'm not saying that we "can't" know, I'm saying that I'm not convinced by the data that has thus far been presented about "President" Lincoln.
10 Aug 05
Originally posted by rwingettAgain, I'm not leading us into your infinite regress. I'm calling for uniform standards.
Nonsense. You don't give a fig about Lincoln's Presidency. All you're trying to do is to undercut our basis for claiming any sort of objective knowledge so you can try to weasel in your theism on equal footing. Well, it doesn't work. If you lead us into the infinite regress, then your theistic claims are just as unknowable as any other sort of data. If you undercut the basis for objective knowledge, it doesn't help your case at all.
10 Aug 05
Originally posted by Bosse de NageBaloney...
You aren't Napoleon?
I'm Napoleon. I captured Waterloo and now looking to conquer Palm Springs. My wife is Angelina Jolie and I am about to announce my creation of a new protein shake that will cure cancer and acne.
So with King's attempt to challenge faith in the existence Lincoln's presidency, to lead everyone to Christ, what about those "other gods"?
There are documents claiming the existence of Zeus, Odin, and the like. American Indians believed in many different gods of the elements and what not.
You are attempting to sell your faith...okay sell it.
10 Aug 05
Originally posted by wibDo you think African Americans are still slaves? If not, who freed them? Did he/she/it have the proper authority to do so? I don't consider Lincoln to be either God or religion. Perhaps you feel that my attack on the "President" is attacking your religious position?
Why? You either have faith in your God/religion or you don't. Why do you care what others think?
10 Aug 05
Originally posted by kingdanwaI am not understanding this thing. Are you implying Lincoln was never
Do you think African Americans are still slaves? If not, who freed them? Did he/she/it have the proper authority to do so? I don't consider Lincoln to be either God or religion. Perhaps you feel that my attack on the "President" is attacking your religious position?
president? What possible differance did it make if he said or never
said "I am President" It doesn't make him more and doesn't make
him less presidential whether he said it or not. How you judge a
leader is by his accomplishments