I wonder if there are homosexual virgins?

Originally posted by ivanhoe
Being homosexual is not a sin, performing the homosexual act however is.

How can a universal truth be confined to a certain part of this universum ?

It is your theological contention that it is a unverisal truth. However,
there are many theological perspectives -- some within Christianity and
some within Roman Catholicism -- who do not accept this so-called
universality. Consequently, they would say you are confining them from
participating in a sacred freedom which is part of what they opine to be
the universum.

This is an extremely intolerant attitude. It is an example of how an ideology, neo-liberalism, which claims to advocate freedom for all is in reality aiming at restricting the freedoms of those not adhering to that ideology.

Whoa. Whoa. I'm totally supportive of your right to believe that homosexuality
is a sin. You can believe whatever you want, Ivanhoe. I also support
yoru right to participate in a worship environment that asserts that
homosexuality is a sin. You have my whole-hearted endorsement for
that.

What you do not have is my support for your insistence that other
people agree with your understanding of what God's Will is, what He views
as sin and views as permissible. And, when you oppose secular homosexual
unions that influence their ability to raise a family as they see fit, to file
their taxes jointly, or be able to visit each other in the hospital, then you
have begun to tread on their rights as individuals on the basis of their
orientation.

I will never support a law that would force a church to give Communion
to a practicing, unrepentant gay individual. And I would never support
a law that uses, as its basis, a theological argument to restrict other
people's secular rights.

Does your banning from the public to the private sphere also apply to the above expressed opinion ?

You can think that homosexual unions are the product of the devil, and
express that as loudly as you want. When you want to make it illegal,
or 'less legal' than heterosexual unions without making a secular
argument is when my comment applies.

A friendship between two men or two women can indeed be "blessed, sacred and holy", but only the friendship, not the eventual homosexual acts performed in the context of this relationship. Sins are never blessed by the Lord. Sins can never be holy or sacred. It is turning the world upside down.

As I said: other people opine differently as to what 'sin' is and whether
a homosexual union can, indeed, be sin-free. Since 'sin' is a theological
notion, using the so-called intrinsic sinfulness of homosexuality as a basis
for preventing them from having secular benefits afforded to other
people is deeply problematic.

Calling evil good and good evil, as you do, doesn't solve anything and will not make people truly happy. On the contrary, it will obfuscate the moral truth even more and will in the end produce more unhappiness and sadness for everybody involved instead of eliminating it.

You opine that 'moral truth' entails certain core principles. Other people
opine differently. If you want to make a case against the permissibility
of homosexuality, I'm all ears, but for it to have any influence in the
secular sphere, it ought to be free of words like 'sin' and 'God.'

For my part, and many other people, it is you who is keeping
the 'good' as evil and the 'evil' as good in this regard. And, since it
remains the realm of opinion, we have to chalk it up as a theological
disagreement.

As it pertains to the public sphere, the question is 'Does a person's
orientation, in and of itself, (and their comfort with expressing that
orientation in their private relationships) impact their ability to be
good parents?' or 'Does a person's orientation (as above) give them
different entitlements with respect to their partners' health and finances?'
or 'Does a person's orientation (as above) provide a legitimate excuse
for discrimination?'

Do you have answers to these secular questions, Ivanhoe?

Nemesio

Originally posted by Nemesio
Originally posted by ivanhoe
[b]Being homosexual is not a sin, performing the homosexual act however is.

How can a universal truth be confined to a certain part of this universum ?

It is your theological contention that it is a unverisal truth. However,
there are many theological perspectives -- some within Christianity and
some w ...[text shortened]... ou have answers to these secular questions, Ivanhoe?

Nemesio[/b]

Originally posted by GinoJ
BS.

Originally posted by Nemesio
Any support for that?

...and because you wrote one page long does not mean that you have any real support yourself.

It just means that you are good at writing BS.

here's what you want..

meatspin.com....check it out and go nuts

Originally posted by MikeBruce
I wonder if there is such thing as a homosexual couple that are virgins and they really respect each other and want to wait?

Originally posted by eamon o
hey people,
hand of hecate is not satisfied with open comments in the debate forum so he sent me this message, which i would like to share.
what do people think about it?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------


Surely we can find a nice Catholic Church somewhere in the middle.

>Can you make barn yard sound s ...[text shortened]... you have cheerleading experience?
Do you have a pretty mouth?
How do you feel about fisting?

Originally posted by eamon o
wait for what ?

Originally posted by MikeBruce
OK my point was ... it is tought in some families to wait until your maried or wait a respectible amount of time for sex.

just wondering if any gay couples wait. homo or lesbian whatever.

This is a point to help me decide a couple things in my life. I was tought that homosex is wrong. Now that I think for myself, I dont really care if there are homos ...[text shortened]... ay or not.

I dont know im not against it either way. this is just kinda a case study for me.

Originally posted by MikeBruce
OK my point was ... it is tought in some families to wait until your maried or wait a respectible amount of time for sex.

just wondering if any gay couples wait. homo or lesbian whatever.

This is a point to help me decide a couple things in my life. I was tought that homosex is wrong. Now that I think for myself, I dont really care if there are homos ...[text shortened]... ay or not.

I dont know im not against it either way. this is just kinda a case study for me.

Originally posted by wib
A couple of things. First, no church has ever been "forced" to marry two gay people. There is no law on the books, nor any pending, that would require such a thing.

There's nothing wrong with believing homosexual sex is wrong. It's unfortunate you were "taught" that, but it sounds like you're already breaking away from what you're told to believe and ins ...[text shortened]... eople are actually having a lot of it. Probably means just the opposite.

Originally posted by Hand of Hecate
Come on now big boy, lets get it on. If you want my public comment, here it is: Keep your anti-gay remarks to yourself. I don't care why you think its OK. I don't care who touched you inappropriately as a child. I don't care if you struggle with your own sexuality on a regular basis. But, I sure as hell don't need to hear about you scalping homo ...[text shortened]... , I'd ask that you keep your hatred to yourself. Get over yourself you stupid, inbred git.

Originally posted by Nordlys
If I'd decide not to eat chocolate, and I'd manage to do so, I'd feel good because I'd feel that I am in control of my own life, and because I'd have mastered a challenge.

Originally posted by wib
First - I don't care.

And second - your response had nothing to do with what I posted.