06 Apr 09
1 edit
Originally posted by ScriabinYou want facts? You've come to the right man. Although, what I say is always true and shouldn't have to back it up. y'all should know I am a truthsayer.
silly argument over whether recycling is good or bad. It depends on a lot of factors.
my county government, for example, requires recycling because all that paper and the plastic and aluminum cans take up a huge amount of increasingly valuable and scarce landfill space. The county recovers a degree of its waste handling costs thru the program.
recent e assertions. They appear to be ideological in nature.
I'm listening.. Where are the facts?
http://www.newsregister.com/article/38234-recycling+surge+crashes+market
You increase the supply of something, you decrease the value of it. Simple economics.
06 Apr 09
2 edits
Originally posted by dystoniacnot just estrogen. Think about it. All medication is flushed down the system when people urinate. The sewage treatment systems aren't designed to remove pharmaceuticals from the waste stream. Your sewage treatment plant discharges eventually to a water body.
I live in the Bay area....I recently read somewhere that some
recycled-treated-chlorinated drinking water in California contained estrogen from birth control pills taken by women. This is disgusting....man-teats...
Now your water treatment plant intakes that now contaminated water and doesn't treat for pharmaceuticals either. So EVERY kind of pharmaceutical product is in your drinking water.
But it is at extrememly low quantities because it has been diluted. The numbers are so low most health departments have said they have no human health impact. They don't bio-accumulate so as you drink water they just pass through your system normally.
So, should you drink bottled water instead? No. The Bottled water industry doesn't perform as much testing as a municipal plant does and alot of it like Dasani
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines04/0304-04.htm
comes from the municipal system anyway!!
http://www.cbc.ca/health/story/2006/03/23/drugs-060323.html
06 Apr 09
Originally posted by dystoniacc'mon ... wouldn't it be better if EVERYONE went up a cup size? ....
I live in the Bay area....I recently read somewhere that some
recycled-treated-chlorinated drinking water in California contained estrogen from birth control pills taken by women. This is disgusting....man-teats...
06 Apr 09
Originally posted by kmax87To throw things away just so someone can make a new one is a delusion, as false as all the forced recycling schemes.
The idea that waste is good because it encourages further economic activity through further consumption of fresh as yet unexploited resources has got to be one of the most asinine - head in the sand - ideologies, that will ensure an earth that when it finally reaches the tipping point, will rapidly go into inexorable decline.
I don't know that there are many people that do actually throw things away because they think it might provide someone with something to do, do you kmax?
I do know that the other delusion is all to prevalent.
Originally posted by uzlessI just look at recycling, from a what to do with my own household waste perspective, and since we started composting and being very particular about separating out all packaging and plastic we dispose of 1 garbage bag of waste per week.
So we'll put you in the "GOVERNMENT FUNDED RECYCLING" category then. How much more money are you willing to give the government to recycle the things you don't want anymore?
If that home spun view took off and became the way we did things everywhere, such that instead of flashy one use packaging we moved to co-op style getting produce by filling up reusable containers we could start to change our one use mentality and hopefully over time, the notion that if we thought about how we consumed everything and we were actually concerned about how we used energy to create our products, we could end up with a totally different world.
To simply say there's no point getting into it until there's a profit to be made out of it is a very negative backwards looking worldview. Changing the expectations of people such that they become appalled at the notion at how much energy has to be mobilised to keep manufacturing the same disposable item, may cause a rethink that will finally make the art of using as little energy as possible commonplace and with it recycling will become a profitable business. Granted it may never be as profitable as wasting. And for sure the profit may not be concentrated in one or two hands, but you would have to say that if getting there requires some government spending to stimulate the market for it, then so be it.
06 Apr 09
1 edit
Originally posted by WajomaPeople aren't making that decision or choice knuckle head. Ever hear of planned obsolescence where products are produced in ways that barely let them get past their warranties? Industry thinks its okay to produce cheap throwaway items and items that have very short life spans because they get to produce the replacement items in ever shorter product cycles. Because the market for these products depend on volume sales, the more and more often of these products as can be sold is imperative for the health of many corporations bottom lines. If you think that is a delusion, then you have cognitive, observational and perceptual issues.
To throw things away just so someone can make a new one is a delusion, as false as all the forced recycling schemes.
I don't know that there are many people that do actually throw things away because they think it might provide someone with something to do, do you kmax?
I do know that the other delusion is all to prevalent.
06 Apr 09
Originally posted by dystoniacI read ... somewhere?
I live in the Bay area....I recently read somewhere that some
recycled-treated-chlorinated drinking water in California contained estrogen from birth control pills taken by women. This is disgusting....man-teats...
and off we go.......
not credible
06 Apr 09
Originally posted by ScriabinValuable and scarce landfill space? Come on, even in Holland this is no problem whatsoever.
silly argument over whether recycling is good or bad. It depends on a lot of factors.
my county government, for example, requires recycling because all that paper and the plastic and aluminum cans take up a huge amount of increasingly valuable and scarce landfill space. The county recovers a degree of its waste handling costs thru the program.
recent ...[text shortened]... e assertions. They appear to be ideological in nature.
I'm listening.. Where are the facts?
06 Apr 09
1 edit
Originally posted by ScriabinOh Mon Dieux my usually reliable petite ami.
I read ... somewhere?
and off we go.......
not credible
The Contamination? C'est Vraie!
It took me 2 seconds on google to confirm. A rare lapse of lazyness perhaps?
http://www.kcbs.com/Estrogen-Related-Hormone-Found-In-SF-Drinking-Wate/1799062
06 Apr 09
1 edit
Originally posted by kmax87Recycling, is not the panacea. There are 3 R's. Recycling is the LAST OPTION, not the first option as is commonly misunderstood.
I just look at recycling, from a what to do with my own household waste perspective, and since we started composting and being very particular about separating out all packaging and plastic we dispose of 1 garbage bag of waste per week.
If that home spun view took off and became the way we did things everywhere, such that instead of flashy one use packagin getting there requires some government spending to stimulate the market for it, then so be it.
The First is REDUCE. Reduce the amount of junk you have to throw away.
The Second is REUSE. Reuse or give to other people things you don't want.
THE LAST OPTION IS RECYCLE.
The problem is that recycling cost a junkload of money. While we all agree tossing things in a landfill isn't environmentally friendly, it is the cheapest. And costs are the only thing most people in N. America care about. They think their taxes are already too high.
Give them the following choice and see what they choose.
Landfill your garbage for $60/tonne
or
Recycle your garbage for $200/tonne which will mean an extra 5% increase on your property tax bill.
Read any of your local newspaper when it comes time to your city/state budget and you'll see that residents are pissed because their taxes are going up. We say the Environment is important but we refuse to pay to make it better.
06 Apr 09
Originally posted by uzlessah, but the point is you put the burden on me to find that article and that was wrong of you, old bean.
Oh Mon Dieux my usually reliable petite ami.
The Contamination? C'est Vraie!
It took me 2 seconds on google to confirm. A rare lapse of lazyness perhaps?
http://www.kcbs.com/Estrogen-Related-Hormone-Found-In-SF-Drinking-Wate/1799062
My point is that if you are going to make an assertion, provide the cite and a summary.
06 Apr 09
Originally posted by Scriabinactually that was Dystonic's post you responded to. I just provided the back up.
ah, but the point is you put the burden on me to find that article and that was wrong of you, old bean.
My point is that if you are going to make an assertion, provide the cite and a summary.