1 edit
Originally posted by NowakowskiYes, this smearing of the opening and the middlegame seems rather uncourageous and rather silly to me.
Well, i think its useful for weaker players... as long as they remain in their element, their own opening, or something similar to your usual repertoire.
Gaining small opening advantages is great, but if you don't have an opening plan that you follow, it usually just blows up.
Originally posted by eldragonflyBut there is the rub.
i don't understand Greenpawn, but it seems to me that either you know a line or a variation or you don't. If it brings you peace of mind then so be it.. Having a database walk you through the opening and into a strong middlegame position just isn't real chess. So many unanswered questions.
I would never use a database.
Databases are made up of other players games and you have to check
who is playing who. Recently a friend of mine looked at a line he saw
in a Philidor DB. which won. Before playing the move OTB he checked
it again and found a huge hole. He then checked the original sourse.
It was from an u12 girls championship.
Also some players will sudenly get dumped into a position they do not
understand and will make middle game errors.
Blindly following a DB can he very dodgy.
But if I go down a line I've already played, and I play the Latvian
which is tactically narrow, then I will look again at what happened
in my game.
As for book use.
I see your point but how can you stop someone repeating
well known moves from an opening book, ask us to send in
our library cards to see what books we have taken out?
Originally posted by eldragonflyI suggest RHP to create a class of tournments where using opening books and databases is not allowed. But keep the current rules for other tournments.
At the risk of repeating myself, that is not real chess and all things being equal that's the cowardly lion approach. Maybe it's just me, but if i lose a game or blow an opening or hang a piece i don't cry about it.
I also suggest RHP to create another class of tournments - Fisherrandom and Chess 960
What do you guys think?
Originally posted by smaiaRules are only useful if they can be policed. How would you check whether or not someone is using a database or looking at a book? It would be impossible.
I suggest RHP to create a class of tournments where using opening books and databases is not allowed. But keep the current rules for other tournments.
I also suggest RHP to create another class of tournments - Fisherrandom and Chess 960
What do you guys think?
Originally posted by eldragonflyGood for you. This is a correspondence chess site and CC has always allowed the use of books and by logical extension, databases. The major reason I even play on CC sites is to study and practice various opening ideas and the resultant middlegame positions for use in OTB play; I don't care a whit about ratings. There are many timed sites on the net which forbid the use of databases and books; at least one (FICS) is free. If that's your idea of "real chess" (of course, nothing on the internet is quite like OTB), play there.
At the risk of repeating myself, that is not real chess and all things being equal that's the cowardly lion approach. Maybe it's just me, but if i lose a game or blow an opening or hang a piece i don't cry about it.
Originally posted by KeplerWell, you could check the opening moves against databases but not printed books, But I have to admit it is indeed very hard to catch opening cheats. Assume someone played all theory up to move 20 and yet, this player may well know the opening very well, i.e. played the moves from his/her own memory and knowledge.
Rules are only useful if they can be policed. How would you check whether or not someone is using a database or looking at a book? It would be impossible.
But you have to admit that players with access to databases, books, analyses, etc. have an unfair advantage over the ones that do not have access to these resources or simply are not interested in using opening theory.
Originally posted by smaiaEverybody on the net has access to perfectly good databases. There's nothing "unfair" about using tools anybody else could if they so desired.
Well, you could check the opening moves against databases but not printed books, But I have to admit it is indeed very hard to catch opening cheats. Assume someone played all theory up to move 20 and yet, this player may well know the opening very well, i.e. played the moves from his/her own memory and knowledge.
But you have to admit that players with access ...[text shortened]... that do not have access to these resources or simply are not interested in using opening theory.
Originally posted by greenpawn34I used an online database towards the end of my playing period on this site as I was trying to learn a few new openings. I must say it didn't work very well for me as I didn't have a sufficient understanding of the positions I reached to be able to play them properly.
I would never use a database.
Now I have gone back to my original methods for learning new openings - going through lots of games by stronger players and then playing shedloads of blitz games, attempting to emulate the stronger players' games.
Originally posted by smaiaIt's not an unfair advantage, particularly in the case of those 'not interested in opening theory'.
But you have to admit that players with access to databases, books, analyses, etc. have an unfair advantage over the ones that do not have access to these resources or simply are not interested in using opening theory.
In my opinion the only real chess is blindfold chess. Being able to see the board gives you an unfair advantage. You should be able to do it all in your head. I suggest that ouroboros' script for making the pieces invisible gets implemented for the whole site. Anyone who is caught setting up a board will be banned.
1 edit
Originally posted by no1marauderTrue.
Everybody on the net has access to perfectly good databases. There's nothing "unfair" about using tools anybody else could if they so desired.
But online databases are not the only resource available. There are books, Chess Informant, periodicals, all with in-depth analysis of almost every opening including recent theorical novelties, etc. A serious player with a solid opening repertoire will likely always research (and expand) these sources in a consistent basis etc.
These resources are not "free" in the net. The complete collection of Chess Informant costs several hundred dollars. Books and magazines are expensive too.
How many times you came out of the opening with a huge or decisive advantage because you had much more opening data available than your opponent?
But I have an easy solution to the openings problem:
Introduce chess 960 as an option in RHP.
Originally posted by greenpawn34good point you make, but still i'm down for my real world OTB chess skills not selfishly and incourageously cheating at every possible turn. As for this mysterious "dumping out" into an unknown and unfamiliar position, that is not the whole story.
As for book use.
I see your point but how can you stop someone repeating
well known moves from an opening book, ask us to send in
our library cards to see what books we have taken out?