Originally posted by googlefudgeWhen RJ is involved, it is not joking. When I am involved, half of my shyte is a joke....
This is one of those times where I can't tell if people are being serious or joking...
Teetotal means someone who doesn't drink alcoholic drinks.
I think people should lighten up, ESPECIALLY about religion.
People get so frigging serious they start wars over it. ENOUGH with the wars already.
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Originally posted by sonhouseOk. I promise not to start any religious wars today.
When RJ is involved, it is not joking. When I am involved, half of my shyte is a joke....
I think people should lighten up, ESPECIALLY about religion.
People get so frigging serious they start wars over it. ENOUGH with the wars already.
Originally posted by robbie carrobieI think what needs to be discused is whom or who is the scripture refering to.
lets here those who prefer to proffer their own opinions instead of scripture explain the following,
1 Corinthians 5:13
New International Version
God will judge those outside. "Expel the wicked person from among you."
New Living Translation
God will judge those on the outside; but as the Scriptures say, "You must remove the evil person fr ...[text shortened]... e; and put ye away the evil from among yourselves.
http://biblehub.com/1_corinthians/5-13.htm
When my time comes you will celebrate my death.
Originally posted by divegeesterWhen i look at the J.W.'s, i make the same statements i always have.
Referring to people leaving their religion to join Jehovah's Witnesses:
"No one should be forced to worship in a way that he finds unacceptable or be made to choose between his beliefs and his family."
Awake! 2009 July p.29 (p.28)
However...
Regarding those disfellowshipped from Jehovah's Witnesses:
"Really, what your beloved fami ...[text shortened]... ped family member, for example, through e-mail."
Watchtower Study Edition 2013 Jan 15 p.16
What part of God is not God. If a man (woman for you Suzianne), loves God with his heart, does he not also love Jesus and the Spirit too. Just because a person chooses not to believe in Jesus or the Spirit, will not condemn them. And a person may not even believe in God for that matter, but God will still live in them, if they love.
Is God not LOVE? If anyone loves, has compassion for thier fellow human being, God lives in them. And this is for the Athiests too.
Robbie,
Is it true that Jehovah's witnesses teach that only 144,000 witnesses will be saved for eternal life? Is it true that Jehovah's witnesses think that they know as much spiritual truth as Peter and John who walked with Jesus and who were apostles? Is it true that Jehovah's witnesses believe Christ Jesus is just another created angel who is named the Son of God?
KOP
Pudgenik,
Salvation is in the Son of God. It isn't in loving mankind.
Romans 3:20
Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.
James 2: 10
For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
In Luke 23: 39-43, whom did the thief on the cross love to get to paradise? In Acts 16: 30-31, whom did the jailer love to gain eternal life after he spoke to Paul and Silas asking "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?" The next verse shows, "And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house."
King James Version
====================
John 14:6
Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
John 3: 17-18
For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
Ephesians 2: 8-9
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Originally posted by PudgenikA fair point, but actually you are describing humanism.
When i look at the J.W.'s, i make the same statements i always have.
What part of God is not God. If a man (woman for you Suzianne), loves God with his heart, does he not also love Jesus and the Spirit too. Just because a person chooses not to believe in Jesus or the Spirit, will not condemn them. And a person may not even believe in God for that matter ...[text shortened]... as compassion for thier fellow human being, God lives in them. And this is for the Athiests too.
Originally posted by KingOnPointNo the vast majority of witnesses profess the belief that they will reside forever upon an earthly paradise, where 144,000 persons will rule with Christ and form the heavenly Kingdom, both will see eternal life eventually.
Robbie,
Is it true that Jehovah's witnesses teach that only 144,000 witnesses will be saved for eternal life? Is it true that Jehovah's witnesses think that they know as much spiritual truth as Peter and John who walked with Jesus and who were apostles? Is it true that Jehovah's witnesses believe Christ Jesus is just another created angel who is named the Son of God?
KOP
No, Jehovahs witnesses don't claim to be inspired of God unlike the apostles of Christ although I would say that we are now in a better position to understand more simply because we have the complete Bible and the time and leisure to put the constituent parts together and form a whole.
No its true the witnesses believe that Christ is the firstborn of all creation, the only creature to be directly created by God, hence the title 'only begotten son', that he has a preeminent position among Gods heavenly sons (the angles) and that he is the archangel Micheal, the term angel merely refers to his being sent my God, for thats what the term means, a sent one, he is therefore not like 'just another created angel'. We also believe that he was the messiah.
http://www.jw.org/en/
Originally posted by robbie carrobieAnd you also believe that he (Jesus) is "mighty god" as refered to by Isaiah? Where Jehovah is "almighty god", and accepted therefore that you have by definition 2 gods.
No the vast majority of witnesses profess the belief that they will reside forever upon an earthly paradise, where 144,000 persons will rule with Christ and form the heavenly Kingdom, both will see eternal life eventually.
No, Jehovahs witnesses don't claim to be inspired of God unlike the apostles of Christ although I would say that we are now in ...[text shortened]... 'just another created angel'. We also believe that he was the messiah.
http://www.jw.org/en/
And you have accepted in this forum that he Jesus the archangel is co-saviour with Jehovah and therefore by definition an angel is co-saviour. But we know that angels are not to be worshiped...
...which is of course why you and lamb-chop (Galveston) both refused to address why the child was worshiped by the magi in the star of Bethlehem threads.
Yep, all doctrinally sound. Not.
Why would Christ be created at all? Why do you believe that an angel controls your eternal life? Eternal life is not bound to a created angel. Salvation for eternal life is bound in the sinless God through Christ Jesus who is God. It is not bound in a created being.
Why do witnesses think Christ is Michael? Where is the scripture that proves that? Was Michael a leader to Lucifer?
King James Version
===============
Hebrews 1: 1-8, 13
God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.
For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?
And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.
And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire.
But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.
But to which of the angels said he at any time, Sit on my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool?
Hebrews 2: 5
For unto the angels hath he not put in subjection the world to come, whereof we speak.
-------------------------
John 1: 1-15
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
The same was in the beginning with God.
All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
In him was life; and the life was the light of men.
And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
There was a man sent from God, whose name was John.
The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all men through him might believe.
He was not that Light, but was sent to bear witness of that Light.
That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.
He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.
He came unto his own, and his own received him not.
But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
John bare witness of him, and cried, saying, This was he of whom I spake, He that cometh after me is preferred before me: for he was before me.
Originally posted by KingOnPointKOP, if you are going to enter into debate with the slippery duo you may be better placed to keep your responses very concise and very on point, as they will use any side issue, deflection or other dubious debating tactic to avoid the pertinacity of your post.
Why would Christ be created at all? Why do you believe that an angel controls your eternal life? Eternal life is not bound to a created angel. Salvation for eternal life is bound in the sinless God through Christ Jesus who is God. It is not bound in a created being.
Why do witnesses think Christ is Michael? Where is the scripture that proves that ...[text shortened]... is was he of whom I spake, He that cometh after me is preferred before me: for he was before me.